1928 Shilling

[r9453]

OK, how about this Ebay item, its $305 and this seller never includes a grade in his listings.

I'm thinking it might be getting close to EF? Maybe even gEF?
 

[markn]

Given the amount of moustache left and the detail in the crown I'd happily grade that one aEF.  Wouldn't be surprised to see it graded EF.

[stevo1962]

Looks to be GVF but at $305 that would put it at full retail

[r9453]

Yes, thank you, I was going to edit/remove my remark about maybe even gEF. The 3rd & 4th pearls are not quite clearly defined but I can see the extra detail in the grass beneath the C of A and in the King's regalia.

Looks to be GVF but at $305 that would put it at full retail

Thanks again stevo, looks like I will have to keep searching. I think I'm starting to get the hang of the difference between VF & EF but differentiating gVF from aEF seems daunting.

Btw, would you say there is an even graduation from VF - gVF - aEF - EF, if you get my drift?

[markn]

Thanks again stevo, looks like I will have to keep searching. I think I'm starting to get the hang of the difference between VF & EF but differentiating gVF from aEF seems daunting.

Btw, would you say there is an even graduation from VF - gVF - aEF - EF, if you get my drift?

That's all part of the fun of grading.  People will always disagree on split grades.  I'd call it aEF because there's a goodly amount  of moustache showing.  IMHO people look too quickly to the pearls in the crown as the only way of grading George V coins.  However, with softly struck issues (like the 1928 shilling) you need to look a little further.

That being said I don't really see any issues with Steve's grade of gVF.

[stevo1962]

Looks to be GVF but at $305 that would put it at full retail

Thanks again stevo, looks like I will have to keep searching. I think I'm starting to get the hang of the difference between VF & EF but differentiating gVF from aEF seems daunting.

Btw, would you say there is an even graduation from VF - gVF - aEF - EF, if you get my drift?
[/quote]
You have to take a lot of points into consideration first.
You'd have to look at each coin and judge it on its own merits,taking into account strike,wear,detracting marks etc and try to form your own opinion and then spend accordingly.I've looked at thousands of coins so I would hope that I'd get close to the accepted grade estimate,but in
saying that it's still just my opinion

[r9453]

Thank you both, I feel that I learnt quite a lot in these couple of threads.

Getting back to my point about the graduation from VF to gVF to aEF to EF (I assume its similar going from EF to Unc) and given that each grade has a monetary value. Say for this 1928 shilling the difference between gVF and aEF is about $50 which I'd be happy to split.

But what about a 1915H shilling where the same difference (in grade) is more like $500? I don't suppose one can be more precise (in regard to approach to grading) about a 1915H than a 1928 so do we continue to split the difference and learn to live with it as we move up into the stratosphere of increasing grades and prices?

[Fulvio]

I don't suppose one can be more precise (in regard to approach to grading) about a 1915H than a 1928

Values shouldn't enter into this at all. Grades are written in stone, values are more like vapour trails... very ephemeral.

Barring some calamity, like mishandling or PVC or whatever, a coin's grade isn't going to change. It will certainly not improve, only degrade. Opinions may vary about what that grade is, but that's only natural in a subjective field such as this.

Values however are not only subjective, but influenced by external unrelated factors. Today's $1,000 investment could be tomorrow's $100 fire sale, and vice-versa.

So why would you change your grading based on relative values? Grade a coin on its merits, and don't take the value into account at all. Then with that grade firmly in mind, go find the best (or worst, depending which side of the transaction you're on) price you can.

[wwwww]

It's been dipped, otherwise aEF.

[r9453]

It's been dipped, otherwise aEF.

Thank you for your comment. I was too busy thinking about grade and didn't think of anything else.

So why would you change your grading based on relative values? Grade a coin on its merits, and don't take the value into account at all. Then with that grade firmly in mind, go find the best (or worst, depending which side of the transaction you're on) price you can.

Thanks Fulvio, :good:

[gnome61]

Just adding to this thread, thought it was pointless to start anything new. Just in regards to the overdate on the 33/34 shilling thread. I am still working on this one when I get the chance, a 1928 shilling with what appears to be an overdate. I am thinking possibly a 1923 similar to the 1925 examples. Still trying to get a clearer image for it so still a work in progress atm.

[fred lever]

Good work Gnome.
The date changes on shilling dies were always messy.
For a good long look at the dates between 1920 and 1933 check out my article the 1924 shilling published in CAB August 2016 vol19-07.
The mint did some awful things to the 1928 tooling, to clear space for the incoming 8 they ground the nose off the right-hand trefoil!
You can clearly see grinding marks where the butchery is done.
The coin type is not an "overdate" it's just one of a series of poor tool hubbing technique when the whole date is changed from one year to another.
The donor die/punch could be any date, say 1925 with the 5 removed, the 8 punched in.
the first 3 digits are never quite in line with the incoming and you see the remnants of the old date 192 under the new 192.
Also check out any references on the Chinese 1928 forged coins, there were thousands of those laundered onto the market at the time, enough to concern the Federal Police.
There is a  die marker to recognise those, i cannot remember what it was.
If you need a copy of the CAB article just email me and I can send you a PDF.
Cheers, Fred.

[gnome61]

Thanks Fred,

[nealeffendi]

Oh Fred? The Australian Federal police didn't exist in 1928 as they were founded in 1979 from the commonwealth police who came into existence in 1960. It would have been state police interested in the fake shillings.
Now none of them state/federal give 2 hoots about all the fake shillings and other coins coming in from China. I still have 2 fake shillings in genuine MS65 PCGS slabs and I know of others who have been burnt by the fakes and the police sit on their thumbs.

[Basilstate]

Now none of them state/federal give 2 hoots about all the fake shillings and other coins coming in from China. I still have 2 fake shillings in genuine MS65 PCGS slabs and I know of others who have been burnt by the fakes and the police sit on their thumbs.

Yes,Feds have higher priorities and don't really care.

The worst egs are the fake gold bars in the Perth Mint packaging,very hard to pick.
Nine Journo's gave them all the details including the Chinese Co. making them but nothing happened,at least publicly. 
They are still out there for sale.