Cheap 2x2s, but be quick.

[Triggersmob]

Might have to give that a go.

[Basil]

See if you can source them out of China. Postage is negligible, which is how so many companies can offer free postage.

There are several suppliers in China,most are on Alibaba but can be hard to find.

Here is a task/challenge for Fulvio,mash up the cardboard on them and then test to see if its acidic.

[Fulvio]

mash up the cardboard on them and then test to see if its acidic.

Wouldn't matter if it was. The Mylar is a barrier, remember?

[Basil]

My 'informant' doesn't know how to test the window material but it would be interesting to see/know exactly what it is formed from.

[Fulvio]

My 'informant' doesn't know how to test the window material but it would be interesting to see/know exactly what it is formed from.

Here's a PDF with the basic tests: http://www.chymist.com/Polymer%20Identification.pdf

And here's another one with WAY more info than a mere human might need. Note the multilayer films however. See why I'm such a fan of chip packets?

[Basil]

Thanks Fulvio,i'll pass it on.

[trout]

As a rule I have found that with most things cheap is not necessarily the most economical in the long run.:ok:
When I first started collecting seriously I bought a mass of "Cheap" albums, flips and those bloody awful Dansco push in folders as well.
I have not only dumped all the nasty "Cheap" PVC albums but also a large percentage of the coins that they ruined with PVC.
The Push in albums resulted in fingerprinted and the odd dropped coin so many of those coins had to be replaced as well, These albums are also now Gone.
The 2x2's that I bought also gave me grief, Mainly due to the staples gouging into other coins, I have since gone down the high quality self adhesive and saflips route and haven't had any problems whatsoever since.
So the money I spent on buying those "Cheap" albums and supplies has been wasted completely.
If I had gone the better quality ( although somewhat more expensive) route at the "Get Go" I would have actually SAVED money and I would still have the coins that the PVC and the Dansco's ruined in my collection.
It's like everything and you will always only get what you pay for in the end.
In reality the good quality supplies are NOT that much more expensive compared to the "Cheap" offerings and they will give you great service for many years.
Check out the gear available on the Purple Penny website and I think you will be pleasantly surprised at the bang you can get for your buck.

[Fulvio]

As a rule I have found that with most things cheap is not necessarily the most economical in the long run.

Agreed. However not for the reasons you might think.

'cheap' implies low cost. That's not the case with this stuff though. We're talking materials technology, and the feedstock, processes and machinery are pretty much the same across the board, regardless of the films being produced. PVC is about the same price as other films. So no, its not 'cheap' in relation to them.

However, design is another matter entirely. PVC was chosen for storage products and packaging for some very good reasons. Its superior clarity and softness, to name two. However, what the early producers didn't know, and latecomers either don't know or don't care about, is its outgassing which bathes your coins in acid.

So we don't spurn PVC because its 'cheap', you see? Rather we avoid it because its not fit for task.

Lets take another hypothetical. Those Saflips you love so much. You could get a roll of the identical material, fire up the old heat sealer and make your own. They wouldn't be any cheaper, allowing for the volume discounts, tooling, shipping and other costs vs your time and effort, but they would definitely not be as nice. They would LOOK 'cheap', but not BE 'cheap', you see?

I'm not impressed with a LOT of numismatic products. Many of them have clearly not been designed by people with in-depth knowledge and long-term archival in mind (think centuries, not years). But this is not a matter of 'cheap' vs 'quality'. Its a question of good vs bad design decisions.

And back to 2x2's for a sec, there are three options:

1. Stapled - Crap, because the staples damage other coins, and the mount is not perfectly sealed.
2. Adhesive - Crap, because the glue lets go after a while and the mount is then not sealed at all.
3. Heat-sealed - Perfect. And also the cheapest option.

Sure, you can argue about heat-sealing Saflips, but that's a lot more expensive, and its still the same material, albeit thicker. Given that this thread is about cardboard 2x2's though, it becomes rather moot. I could talk about recycled chip packets being superior to all of the above, and free, but it wouldn't be on-topic, would it? :angel:

[Triggersmob]

See if you can source them out of China. Postage is negligible, which is how so many companies can offer free postage.

Finally got around to doing this.
Cost was $2.40 for 50 2x2s, with free postage.
Any body like one or two for testing purposes?
Let me know and I'll mail them to you.
They look OK. Nice and clean, not like the ones
I normally get that are covered in cardboard dust.
Would of liked the cardboard to be a bit thicker, so
they hold their shape when a thick coin in inserted.

[Triggersmob]

I found a micrometer that I had tucked away.
The cheap Chinese 2x2's have a film that measures
about 0.05mm, whereas the Airtite ones, that I have
been using, have a film that measures 0.1mm.
Double the thickness, but I'm not sure if that is
really critical.