Genuine ?

markn · August 02, 2014, 04:38:08 PM

Well fellas now that we have bigger images I think it's real. The RDM on the truncation of the portrait has slid towards the missing region of the coin (well spotted PPH), the top line of the Z is noticeably thinned due to radial metal flow, and there's noticeable tapering of the rims near the missing regions of the coin.

As to the curve not being a pure curve, well they often are not. You'll find that the the flat parts of the coin (the fields) flow outwards to fill the clipped area faster than the points of high relief. Presumably because more of the metal flows to fill the die rather than flowing outwards. And this is exactly what I am seeing here.

autocoupler · August 02, 2014, 05:14:41 PM

Quote from: 'Unicorn' pid='56050' dateline='1406949265':welcome: Paul.

Hoping that this one ends well for you.

It might not have Blakesley effect ......

..... so you might have to settle for the Blakey effect! :angel:

:laugh2: Good one uni lol :angel:.............Welcome Paul

nealeffendi · August 02, 2014, 05:31:19 PM

The cent has tapering on the inside edge of the rim where it meets the clip. Probably genuine based on that (could be expertly faked), grade though might be high, so could decimal experts chime in.

trout · August 02, 2014, 06:51:40 PM

What a lot of BS.
The new images show a doctored image IMHO.
The original images (see page 1 of this thread) show irregular marks and bright highlights which are indicative of post mint activity on this coin .
Waiting for Nancy to kick in on this :angel:

markn · August 02, 2014, 07:44:02 PM

Quote from: 'trout' pid='56061' dateline='1406971300'What a lot of BS.
The new images show a doctored image IMHO.
The original images (see page 1 of this thread) show irregular marks and bright highlights which are indicative of post mint activity on this coin .
Waiting for Nancy to kick in on this :angel:

The new images are from the eBay listing. It's a real clip.

Unicorn · August 02, 2014, 07:49:41 PM

You've got me intrigued Mark.

A comparison of the reverse is interesting.

The red arrows show what appear to be 'dings' that flatten out the high points.

But the most interesting part I can now see are the hollows that are along the top of all the left hand side whiskers. (Yellow arrows). These extend quite to a large section of each whisker and add to the theory of a lack of metal in that area. ie: There not being enough to form the rounded top of each whisker.

markn · August 02, 2014, 08:06:02 PM

Good observations Uni. Adds support to the coin being a real error.

Swan dollar · August 02, 2014, 08:27:31 PM

Thanks guys
I am new and from this coin I have learnt heaps of tell tail signs for future purchase... the blakleys effect.. The fish tails of the lettering... the rim being bent over near the clip.. aswell as the fields flowing while under pressure in the minting press oh and the marks on the opposite side..
I am so glad now joining this fourm..
Thanks guys...
Cheers paul

The right hand top whisker has definitely has been tampered with..
Just a theory the left hand side whiskers ( where the yellow arrows are ) could the deformation be caused by this field flowing theory ( while under pressure and because there is no rim touching the collet the metal stretches into a less frictional area ) ..
I am unsure ...
Cheers paul

Nevol · August 02, 2014, 08:48:24 PM

Quote from: 'trout' pid='56061' dateline='1406971300'What a lot of BS.
The new images show a doctored image IMHO.The original images (see page 1 of this thread) show irregular marks and bright highlights which are indicative of post mint activity on this coin .Waiting for Nancy to kick in on this :angel:

Sorry trout, but no comment from me on this one. What I know about clips would fit on a pin head. :angel: I think I might have 3 at the most.

robbiegal · August 02, 2014, 09:38:28 PM

regardless
I do not believe that APCGS have the numismatic expertise to have made a fully informed or expert opinion on such an error, let alone on grading Australian coins both pre and post decimal

they shed a cloud of distasteful shame on the good will of the numismatic community in this country and of the faith that the buying public place on purchasing packaged coins that the legitimate third party grading companies supply to the world market place

they are as fake as their copy cat packaging

Quote from: 'accumulator' pid='55981' dateline='1406877885'What do people think of this 1 cent clip ?
At first glance it looked genuine but after a closer inspection i'm not so sure.
the edges just look too rough in the clipped area & there no tapering at the rims like you see on clips.

accumulator · August 02, 2014, 09:49:28 PM

Paul, I sincerely apologise for causing such a stir but i genuinely thought as most of us did that you had been had,i'm very glad that in the end you have not.

I whole heartedly agree with what Robbie has said in her previous post.

Swan dollar · August 02, 2014, 10:34:29 PM

The right hand top whisker has definitely has been tampered with..
Just a theory the left hand side whiskers ( where the yellow arrows are ) could the deformation be caused by this field flowing theory ( while under pressure and because there is no rim touching the collet the metal stretches into a less frictional area ) ..
I am unsure ...
Cheers paul

markn · August 03, 2014, 07:07:53 AM

Quote from: 'accumulator' pid='56071' dateline='1406981968'Paul, I sincerely apologise for causing such a stir but i genuinely thought as most of us did that you had been had,i'm very glad that in the end you have not.

I whole heartedly agree with what Robbie has said in her previous post.

I am happy that a new member hasn't been diddled with a dud coin. I had a my mis-givings with it too. And I think Robbie summarised the core of the matter here better than I've seen anyone do it.