PCGS vs NGC

[ausproofs]

Nah it's all good p27, I think I know who I am, well some days I do and there's no time limit on anything here really so just enjoy your time mate :friends:

Now to aus, I was actually talking to another member last night about this and we were both on pcgs registry and we are of the opinion that one is a picture and one is actually a scan so when people like, well no names needed :winkextra: but when people crack them out and resubmit hoping for a better grade well now with all the high-tech gizmos apparently they scan all coins now so when it gets scanned again the computer tells them it's already in the system and been done as I think coins are like us and no two are truly identical but this is just a thought
Oh and yes I'll take them aus

Oh okay,  I think they only do this for PCGS coin.. I dont think they compare NGC vs PCGS .. would you know AJ?

I cracked open my NGC coins as it is cheaper to grade raw coins with PCGS than doing crossovers...

Happy for you to take them for $$$$ :yahoo:

PCGS definitely factor it and so as they should....

I tend to disagree , A coin should be graded on its technical qualities and NOT its "eye factor" because that can be different from collector to collector :ok:

http://www.ngccoin.com/news/viewarticle.aspx?IDArticle=3798&Star-designation

Seems NGC is considering eye appeal too...

[ausjack]

thought you might mate LOL. I'm not sure but with technology today who know and they might be linked but I doubt it just yet but I'm thinking PCGS do it on all the recent coins they have done but some old ones that have the white label might make it thru being older and not scanned into the system but who know as we just noticed a pic and then an arrow to the right..here suss this and hopefully if it works properly you'll see an arrow either side of the pic, well click it and take a look, we reckon one is a scan for the computer and one is a pic but we could be wrong and any thoughts most welcome
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistry/alltimeset.aspx?s=82833
nah it didn't work sorry but click on say the 50 cent an hit the side arrows
stupid computers, but if you type in a code and click on the pic you will get two pic's.

[trout]

Sorry AJ but I really don't think any of the TPG's have a database of every single coin ever graded for comparison.
Take my gold Ducat for example, was graded MS63 by NGC then I cracked it out and sent it to PCGS .
It came back "Details" altered surfaces, Then I sent it back to NGC and it came back as a MS65.
I have had this coin in my hand RAW and I cannot see any evidence of "altered surfaces" whatsoever and from MS63 to MS65 is a huge jump in grade from the SAME grading company makes me think that NO they do not keep records of coins coming through and was simply graded by a different grader:ok:
Like I said earlier on this thread , it is simply an opinion from a TPG and NOT an absolute fact about the grade.
All I can advise is to look at the coin and NOT the holder/slab and make an educated assessment of the coin.

[Fr45h3R]

Sorry AJ but I really don't think any of the TPG's have a database of every single coin ever graded for comparison.
Take my gold Ducat for example, was graded MS63 by NGC then I cracked it out and sent it to PCGS .
It came back "Details" altered surfaces, Then I sent it back to NGC and it came back as a MS65.
I have had this coin in my hand RAW and I cannot see any evidence of "altered surfaces" whatsoever and from MS63 to MS65 is a huge jump in grade from the SAME grading company makes me think that NO they do not keep records of coins coming through and was simply graded by a different grader:ok:
Like I said earlier on this thread , it is simply an opinion from a TPG and NOT an absolute fact about the grade.
All I can advise is to look at the coin and NOT the holder/slab and make an educated assessment of the coin.

A coin graded using a PCGS Secure Plus service, will be identified if it is resubmitted raw, and the original certificate will be removed, and also struck from the population report. This is to prevent the scenario where more examples have been graded, than are actually known..

Does the original certificate for your Ducat still work at NGC, or only the MS65 one ?

[ausjack]

Sorry AJ but I really don't think any of the TPG's have a database of every single coin ever graded for comparison

You might be right but amuse me please and put one of your recent numbers into pcgs http://www.pcgs.com/cert/ and then click on the pic, not sure but think it has to be pic and then when it comes up look and there should be an arrow and suss them out as they look like two different pic's and that was the only idea we could come up with as one look really nice and think that's the pic and the other shows every detail on the coin like a scan does.

Yeah I don't know how the same coin can get different grades but there's still just so much for me to learn
A coin graded using a PCGS Secure Plus service, will be identified if it is resubmitted raw

Thanks Rob this is the sort of thing I was talking about.

[trout]

Does the original certificate for your Ducat still work at NGC, or only the MS65 one ?

I sent the original cert to Eric when I re submitted the coin.
I bought the coin from PP so she may have the cert #

[purplepennyhunter]

Trouts Ducat ex NGC

[trout]

Thanks PP :good:
Here is the link in its current holder.

http://www.ngccoin.com/certlookup/index.aspx?CertNumber=3700615-003

[trout]

Seems NGC is considering eye appeal too...

That makes sense to have a + for exceptional eye appeal instead of taking away or adding a numerical grade to the coin :good:

[trout]

This only ONE example of two coins same mint same year graded by both PCGS and NGC.
The lighting and conditions are the same on both coins (it's overcast outside :dash1: )
This is NOT a definitive answer , it is however an interesting comparison of two similar coins graded by two different TPG's . :ok:

The PCGS coin is graded at MS65 and the NGC coin is graded at MS66
There is clearly at least one grading point difference in the two coins.

PCGS Coin



NGC Coin



Here are the coins Side by Side

[stevo1962]

They look pretty much the same.The NGC coin might be a better strike

[markn]

The PCGS coin is graded at MS65 and the NGC coin is graded at MS66
There is clearly at least one grading point difference in the two coins.

The only thing that you've proved with those photos is that you need to learn what manual white balance is.  It's almost impossible to grade high grade coins from great photos, let along the ones you've posted up here.e

[trout]

The PCGS coin is graded at MS65 and the NGC coin is graded at MS66
There is clearly at least one grading point difference in the two coins.

The only thing that you've proved with those photos is that you need to learn what manual white balance is.  It's almost impossible to grade high grade coins from great photos, let alone the ones you've posted up here.

Be Nice Mark, I am NOT as expert as most at taking coin pic's and
I am NOT asking anyone to grade these coins from the images, I am simply putting the two together as a comparison.
Both coins were photographed under exactly the same conditions by an inept operator, that having been said Even blind Freddy can see the NGC coin is a higher grade regardless of the "White Balance".
The strike and the lustre is stronger on the NGC coin and that is readily apparent despite the "Crap" photo's .
That is why it was graded 1 point higher.

At least I made the effort to have "in hand" two coins of the same  year and mintage to do a comparison.
Simply "Throwing rocks" at me for my inability to use a camera at a professional level  is neither constructive or friendly  Mate.

I am NOT trying to prove the NGC is better than PCGS or PCGS is better than NGC , I simply put two coins from two different sides of the continent together and see how the 2 TPG's performed with their grading of these two coins .
So instead of wasting your energies  "Bagging" me , Why not do a similar comparison of two coins from the 2 TPG's  :ok:

[markn]

I am NOT trying to prove the NGC is better than PCGS or PCGS is better than NGC , I simply put two coins from two different sides of the continent together and see how the 2 TPG's performed with their grading of these two coins .
So instead of wasting your energies  "Bagging" me , Why not do a similar comparison of two coins from the 2 TPG's  :ok:

You're flogging the same dead horse with your two shillings because it suits your arguments.  And you're doing so with images that are not supportive of whatever point you're trying to get across.  If you're going to put yourself forward as an authority then you need to have supporting information.  And all we've got is the images you've posted above.

Right now, on at least 3 occasions I can recall you've brought these two shillings up as an example of...well I am not sure what you're trying to say.  But, trout, it's a sample size of one.  It means nothing.  I'll just counter it with your ducat which PCGS wouldn't even grade and NGC somehow upgraded by two whole points.  So there we go, your shillings are now countered by your ducat.

Go take a look at ausproofs grading results, I think they say a lot more than two isolated shillings you happen to own ever will.

[serial]

well then explain it markn as my photos look like that as well when I have fading light.
I for one would love to hear how to make my pictures better
if you could explain you set up that would be good because I would love to be able to do this

oh and on topic trout I see a weaker strike on the pcgs one but a lot more breaks in lustre on the ngc. if I have read correctly they use a point system to count back from 70 in the ms grades I see more marks on the ngc one and would consider that these coins should actually be about equal with the PCGS having more eye appeal imho