ebay ups fees yet again....greedy greedy greedy

[Fulvio]

That is the problem, countries with bloated government payrolls, welfare queens and high taxes would define low tax countries as shonky.

Quite. Just because you run your economy in such a way that it requires less taxation to support it, does not make you shonky. Quite the opposite, I would argue. Its the porkbarelling high-tax regimes that are the shonky ones.

The entire argument comes down to where income is produced, and where tax is paid. Countries like the US, UK, and of course Oz, see foreign companies earning fortunes from their citizens and shipping the proceeds overseas. But they also have companies earning income overseas and shipping it home to be taxed by them. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

And you can't double-tax at both ends, let alone any stops on the way. Imagine if a product designed in Norway by an American company, manufactured in China, shipped through Singapore to a warehouse in Australia then retailed in New Zealand was taxed by all of those regimes, as well as the Irish government where the proceeds eventually ended up. You'd be paying ten times more for everything, and the global economy would collapse.

Governments worldwide need to get a grip on what they're supposed to exist for, and stop acting like parasites. Nobody has any real objection to paying a fair share for necessary services. But most of the BS that emanates from all governments is not even remotely either necessary or a service. Cut the bloat and taxes can fall to levels where nobody would object to paying them.

Remember how the GST was supposed to replace almost all taxes with a flat rate paid at point of sale? Sounded great at the time, and it certainly does grab the dollars at the point of origin. But all it really did was add another level of impost on everything, and more costs in accounting and compliance... and spawn a whole new avoidance industry.

What we need is a global government lottery... every politician and bureaucrat gets a ticket... and all the odd numbers win... a bullet. That would fix the bastids! And if it didn't, do it again next week until it has the desired effect. :diablo:

[Ozcoins]

Shonky:
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/double-irish-with-a-dutch-sandwich.asp
This is just transferring money back and forth just to avoid paying taxes that should have been paid.

[nealeffendi]

Shonky:
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/double-irish-with-a-dutch-sandwich.asp
This is just transferring money back and forth just to avoid paying taxes that should have been paid.

It is the duty of corporations to maximise the returns of investors (mums and dads, your super money). They have a duty to minimise tax, the same way your tax accountant has a duty to minimise your tax through income splitting  and income deferral. So does that make us "shonky" because we don't think excessive taxes "should" be paid and use all methods available to minimise tax?

[Fulvio]

So does that make us "shonky" because we don't think excessive taxes "should" be paid and use all methods available to minimise tax?

There are two basic, opposing world views at work...

Do governments exist to serve the people

or

Do people exist to serve the government?

I would argue that the overwhelming majority of those involved in governing us, no matter what political stripe or where they are on the bureaucratic ladder, think the latter.

I'm one of those who take the opposing view. And I bet you are too when you think about it.

[JeffH]

In a democracy the wishes and aspirations of (all) the people are paramount. Think about our government -is it really democratic?

But, what has this to do with greedy ebay?

[Ozcoins]

But, what has this to do with greedy ebay?

A would think a fair bit.
Not only do they gouge as much as they can out of Australians, they don't pay taxes either.
http://m.smh.com.au/business/how-savvy-multinationals-curb-their-tax-bills-20121116-29hhm.html

Shonky:
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/double-irish-with-a-dutch-sandwich.asp
This is just transferring money back and forth just to avoid paying taxes that should have been paid.

It is the duty of corporations to maximise the returns of investors (mums and dads, your super money). They have a duty to minimise tax, the same way your tax accountant has a duty to minimise your tax through income splitting  and income deferral. So does that make us "shonky" because we don't think excessive taxes "should" be paid and use all methods available to minimise tax?

Define 'excessive'.

[nealeffendi]

In a democracy the wishes and aspirations of (all) the people are paramount. Think about our government -is it really democratic?

But, what has this to do with greedy ebay?

I despise democracy (I'm a libertarian).
Democracy is when you have 3 voters (2 wolves and a sheep) voting on who is for lunch.
We tax slaves get to vote every 3 years on who will be our next master.
Unlike dealing with the government at least with fleabay we can choose not to deal with them.

[Fulvio]

Unlike dealing with the government at least with fleabay we can choose not to deal with them.

Oh, can we now??

I'm the closest you'll get to that, and I gotta say, if I needed to turn a bunch of stuff into folding, say because something went unexpectedly sour, there aren't a whole bunch of options. Mainly because the bastards were allowed to buy up all the alternatives.

FeePay and other behemoths, like Apple and Google, have a lot of the same qualities as governments. They don't quite make the laws, yet, but they still manage to act as if they did.

Apple determine what I can and can't have on my devices. Google determine what I can and can't see. And they blatantly robbed an organisation I'm involved with a couple of years ago.. something apparently they do on a regular basis.

We already know that big business effectively appoints governments. How long do you think it will be before they stop being covert about it?

[dreamcatcher]

Thanks for your post Bigfellani.

My thoughts exactly. I sell regularly on ebay and for lower priced items around the $10-20 mark the fees are almost doubling with this change!

They screwed the buyers a while back when they gave sellers free listings each month - that resulted in nobody listing auctions and everything becoming buy it now.

Of course the above change was offset by an increase in the fvf.

Now they are continuing and increasingly screwing the sellers with yet another increase in fvf!

Are there viable alternatives to ebay here in Australia!?

[Nevol]

Are there viable alternatives to ebay here in Australia!?

The only one I can think of that eBay don't own is Quicksales.  I've bought  on there a few times and had no problems.  

They don't have anywhere near the numbers of items for sale as eBay, and so far they don't yet have a separate section for Coins & Banknotes, need to go into Antiques, Art & Collectables.

http://www.quicksales.com.au/?mkwid=siAe1DkGY&pcrid=28947881911&pmt=b&pkw=%2Bquicksales&plc=&pdv=c&gclid=CNa5ntvBtr0CFcsbpQodNXkAsg

Quicksales: Coins & Notes (10447)

There are quite a few sellers I recognise, but I don't know much about the set-up. How do they make money if the listings are free? I paid no fee as a buyer and if it is truly 100% FREE to sell, maybe we should all just go there and give eBay the old heave ho.

[robbiegal]

I used to use quicksales but the search system is so damned difficult that I can't even find the coins that I have for sale on there!

[Robster]

:dash1:

[Nevol]

I used to use quicksales but the search system is so damned difficult that I can't even find the coins that I have for sale on there!

Replying in http://www.australian-coins.net/showthread.php?tid=744

[trout]

I really don't see what all the "Hoo Haa" is all about.
If an item costs you $3 to post then you are up for an extra 3 cents and I imagine that low value items get sent at 60 cents so are we all raving on about .6 of a cent ?

If it is affecting the people that noodle coins then flip them on ebay at a dollar or 2 at a time for 5,10,20 and 50 cent coins then they have already at least doubled their profit anyway.

*snip* (markn)

[Fulvio]

I really don't see what all the "Hoo Haa" is all about.

Ultimately, power and its misuse to the detriment of all. Something we are supposed to take seriously, or so many would tell you (especially the ACCC), yet we repeatedly stick our heads in the noose.

eBay are no different from the banksters, or the robber barons of days gone by. They are squeezing all alternatives out, and jacking up their take to the absolute hilt.

Sorry, but it wouldn't matter if it was a tenth of a cent. Its not the amount that matters, its the principle. I hear far too many people saying "oh, but its only...", just because they can afford it. Then the next thing you know is everyone who can't afford it is paying twenty bucks for a cup of coffee or twice as much as their income for a roof over their heads or whatever.

And don't get me started on carbon taxes. If people weren't so stupid in the first place, such idiotic half-arsed screwups wouldn't ever see the light of day. But because people ARE idiots (cumulative IQ decreases as the size of a group increases, arguably to zero for the entire globe) and will literally destroy their own life-support systems, even stupider politicians come up with "solutions" like that.

Bah, Humbug.... "Beam me up, Scotty, there's no intelligent life down here"