The shape of the last 2 digits in the date are wrong for sure. The fields don't show any obvious signs of date alteration, it's a good effort.

Quote from: 'nealeffendi' pid='118608' dateline='1551174099'Hi Fred
The original penny was a 1929 Indian as the 4th bead (pearl) on the leading edge of the crown is slightly larger than the others (rules out 1924 and 1927 which was chipped) and for obvious reasons a 1930 penny isn't profitable to turn into a 1931. And as Eric pointed out the '31 is FBL.

So is the current thought that:

A. The date (or a section thereof) of a 1929 Indian obverse penny has had removed and replaced with that of a 1931 dropped 1? or

B. Alternatively, have two halves of these pennnies been adhered together?

What about:

C. Images of two different coins have been used in the listing?

Both days went really well - we only ended up going through about $150 in coins all up which was interesting. This probably means the folks towards the end of the weekend were going through the stuff that had already been sorted earlier in the weekend, however I don't think that detracted from the fun of the idea. There were some adults going through the coins at one stage, just before I went over to read them the riot act about taking coins away from kids etc etc, one of the Perth Numismatic Society volunteers let me know they were parents and grandparents building sets to take home for their kids that didn't come along.
The foreign coin exercise was popular as well, so I reckons we'll be rolling this out at each ANDA show later this year.

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Quote from: 'Mister T' pid='84238' dateline='1454714288'As a bit of a follow-up I got $6 worth of 5c pieces from the bank and didn't find the following years:
1966, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1975, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1988 and 2015.

That's not a bad spread - I collected the 20,000 coins the other day (all 57 kilos of them), they're ready to be sorted on the day. Hopefully the table is strong enough to hold them!

The ideas re the 10¢ and the $1 coins make sense and are great ideas. We might start with the 5¢ coins and see how we go from there though!

The albums printed by Ashton Scholastic are great for kids and the decimal coin sets, we just can't get them in quantity however.

Plastic sheets it will be in the meantime. Come along to the Perth show to see how it goes, if it works well and we can get volunteers, we'll be running the same stands at each of the other ANDA shows in 2016.

Jeff,

Thanks for your feedback. The purpose is to definitely let the kids take home the sets of both the 5¢ coins and the foreign coins they make up. Hopefully a few will get the bug and go on to completing date sets of the other denominations.

The tellers at my local Westpac aren't always happy to see me when I take in my NCLT $5 coins and scrappy paper decimal notes to bank, they don't like extra work it seems! We have a bit of time up our sleeve, so I'll ask them this week if they think they can help.

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Sounds like the harder task will be getting enough coins for the kids to noodle through during both days - if we had 20 kids per day (as an initial guesstimate), is $500 / 10,000 coins going to be enough? Should we budget 100 coins per kid?  

Morning All,

ANDA is looking to add a few interesting activities for kids to take part in at the shows we hold this year.

The idea of these activities is to introduce a new generation of collectors to the fun of collecting coins.

We have 2 ideas at this stage:

1. Foreign coins - kids pick out a range of world coins from a (big) pile that they put into an album sheet, they write up the details of each coin (Country, date, denomination, etc) on the backing sheet.

2. 5¢ coin date sets - kids sort through (another big) pile of 5¢ coins, and add one of each date to an album page that's been laid out to hold a date set.

We aren't kidding ourselves that this is going to work exactly the way we'd like to from the outset, however we're going to make a start, and adjust as we go along and learn.

We'd like these events to be something they remember for years to come, so we're thinking we'll get some stickers made up like "I'm a coin geek!" that they get if they finish, and have a pullup sign with a big photo of "Dollar Bill" (from the 1966 decimal currency marketing campaign) that they can have their photo taken in front of.

All of this is good and well - we've got about 40 kilos of world coins for the Perth show which is more than enough, we've also got the album pages and backing sheets, but haven't yet worked out how to get a decent range of 5¢ dates that they can sort through. We can fund the cost of getting the 5¢ coins easily enough, and have thought 10,000 coins / $500 should be enough.

So here are our questions for you expert noodlers:

1. Is 10,000 coins going to be enough? If not, how many 5¢ coins do you think we should get?
2. What are the chances of getting a reasonable range of dates out of circulation? It isn't realistic to offer every kid the opportunity to get a complete set, however it'd defeat the exercise if they can only get 3-4 dates.
3. Is there any way of increasing the chance of getting a good range of dates?

Thanks in advance for your time, please let me know what you think (good, bad or indifferent).

In my defence, that show was on at 10pm on a Friday night!

In my understanding, those folks that had items on consignment with the Rare Coin Company, whose items were sold without their knowledge and whose interests were not secured on the PPS register, stand to be treated the same as all other unsecured creditors. The likelihood of them recovering any funds at this stage is remote from what I understand.

As his company has entered administration, as far as I'm aware, Mr Jackman certainly isn't looking at receiving any further funds at all from the Rare Coin Company. As he was also taken to court (personally) over a director's guarantee he gave over one specific transaction, I understand that he may well need to declare personal bankruptcy. I understand this will most likely mean that any future income over and above a certain amount will be directed to that former client.

I can say that the first and only complaint that ANDA received re the Rare Coin Company indirectly led to the company entering administration. Despite the huge number of aggrieved customers that have been very significantly affected, we only received one solitary formal complaint.

It isn't up to ANDA or anyone else for that matter to intervene in business transactions between any two individuals, no matter what the circumstances might be.

The very serious issues that have now come to light such as non payment of sales proceeds, sales of counterfeit or grossly mis-described items, and exotic transactions such as the provision of income payments following purchase, all of these have come to light after the fact.

All that said, the ANDA committee is in the process of reviewing our governing documents to include the capacity to take action against members in the absence of a customer complaint, under appropriate circumstances of course. Other changes such as the inclusion of non-members on the governing body (to ensure complete oversight and add complementary skills to the committee) are being considered as well. While we can't change what has happened, I believe we are taking appropriate steps to further increase transparency and confidence in numismatics in Australia.

That link to the PPS register is correct - my understanding is that the few customers of the Rare Coin Company that had registered on this before they went into liquidation have different creditor rights to those that did not.

The basic case is that if the company had "control" over the consigned items at the time the business went into administration, the liquidators are entitled to them, even though title may not have changed.

While this stinks, seems unfair on a fundamental level and may well be overturned via a legal case in future, my understanding is that the precedent in other industries (a bulldozer lease of all things) sees the liquidators entitled to sell the items, and the consignor doesn't get the proceeds.

This is new law and is still being tested, however best to be on the safe side regardless.

One of the theme's for tonight's discussion is going to be horror stories when dealing with coins - i.e., how not to get ripped off when either buying or selling.

Hopefully we keep the tone of the discussion positive, focusing on the positive steps the general public and collectors can take to stay safe, rather than just hear complaints and blaming!

We'll also run over some numismatic news - the ANZAC commemorative program from the RAM, the sale of the Saddle Ridge hoard via Amazon, and anything else you might think of....

The value amount that Customs should be picking up is the declared value - this should be completely different to the declared value on the PCGS paperwork, but the invoice value that PCGS have charged you.

Anything PCGS over $1,000 indicates a decent sized batch - is that correct? You certainly shouldn't be paying GST or even getting caught up in this paperwork for $1,000 - $2,000 worth of coins. If it is the latter there could be a problem with the way PCGS are declaring the value of the parcels.

Although I've had relatively large parcels from PCGS in the past, the only time I had one caught up in Customs was one about 3 weeks ago. I got it cleared (without paying the fee or submitting the N10 form) by emailing Customs and advising them that they were goods being returned.

I submitted a copy of the outbound eparcel manifest (showing the items were sent from Australia), as well as the emails from PCGS demonstrating receipt, and then dispatch (including the EMS parcel number). The submission and parcel numbers all aligned across the different items of correspondence, so it was pretty straightforward.

What kills me is the delay - another 3 weeks on what is an already long process.

You can pick one or a few up from us in Fremantle if you like, we generally have too many in a pile in the corner...

The coins in the Sherwood mint sets are generally reasonable quality, however as they're not an official set, you can generally get them cheaper than the RAM set for that year. The 20 coin proof set is in the book, page 139 of the 21st edition of the McDonald guide, and page 94 of the Renniks' 49th edition. I'd choose the 20 coin set over the standard one for that year, however getting both is the easiest option!

The discussion tonight is indeed going to be very general in nature - we'll run over a few numismatic news items that the general public may have an outside interest in - the Saddle Ridge hoard of gold coins in the US, the 2014-2018 commemorative programs that both mints will be running, as well as a few other things.

It's hard to come up with "fresh" talkback subjects that are likely to be of interest to the general public, we've thought that how to collect is as good a start as any.

I'm heading into the ABC studio to kick off from about 7pm Perth time / 10pm EST if that's any guide to time.

Let me know what you think we could be discussing in future, curly questions are welcomed! These segments are about increasing interest in the hobby and about making more people feel comfortable about doing something - every little bit helps eh?