I saw this linked on CCF today and thought it was worth taking a closer look at: http://www.jinghuashei.com/html/category/class_446.html
This company is apparently one of the better fakers, but looking at their stock most of it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
1915H halfpenny:
(http://www.jinghuashei.com/uploadimage/product/1091518481125576.jpg)
Date looks too big.
1923 halfpenny:
(http://www.jinghuashei.com/uploadimage/product/1091518461170539.jpg)
There's a lot wrong with the date.
1930 penny:
(http://www.jinghuashei.com/uploadimage/product/1091518383943142.jpg)
The date looks slightly off, but another discriminant is the Birmingham reverse (should be London).
1915 shilling:
(http://www.jinghuashei.com/uploadimage/product/1091519303736537.jpg)
The date is wrong.
Centenary florin:
(http://www.jinghuashei.com/uploadimage/product/1091519524584662.jpg)
Rough surfaces and inconsistent wear (the orb on the crown and the rider's head).
1938 crown:
(http://www.jinghuashei.com/uploadimage/product/109151958597380.jpg)
The surface looks a bit rough, as do most of the details.
1855 Sydney Mint sovereign:
(http://www.jinghuashei.com/uploadimage/product/1091519134562841.jpg)
The portrait doesn't look right for a start.
Some of those fakes are pretty good are are no doubt already sitting in some poor unfortunate
collectors album marked as genuine althiugh thankfully many of them are pretty obvoiusly fake
AMAZING a website for an international forgery operation :dash1:
These moungrels are the al-Queda of Numismatics and should be surgicaly removed via smart bombs A.S.A.P :aggressive:
Quote from: 'stevo1962' pid='9424' dateline='1363147086'Some of those fakes are pretty good are are no doubt already sitting in some poor unfortunate collectors album marked as genuine althiugh thankfully many of them are pretty obvoiusly fake
Yeah, I thought a few of those florins looked pretty close to the mark, except for the pitting on the surfaces.
Unfortunately knowledge seems like the most effective weapon here.
I wonder how many coins the "Shady Bunch on eBay†have in their possession right now and poised to rip the unsuspecting collectors off at the moment.
No wonder new collectors get “Jaded†and give the hobby away as a bad joke.
These people are simply crooks and should be prosecuted by the federal Police to the fullest extent of the law.
All the counterfeit imports from China should be treated the same way that drugs, illegal weapons and other contraband are treated, with the exporter brought to justice as well.
It would be better for the authorities to be proactive rather than reactive to these criminal mints and stamp out the imports into Australia of these abominations.
I do my best to promote Numismatics wherever and whenever I have the opportunity but these slimebuckets will do immeasurable damage to this hobby if left unchecked.
You have to remember that the vast majority of collectors WILL be fooled by these fakes and those of us that are “in the know†can’t keep an eye on EVERY sale or auction.
It’s time for the Government to use its resources and infrastructure to stamp out this purely criminal activity.
Just my 2 bobs worth, but I do feel quite strongly on this issue
I went to have a look at the site and all I got was this.
QuoteDangerous Page
Address: http://www.jinghuashei.com/html/category/class_446.html
Trend Micro has confirmed that this website can transmit malicious software or has been involved in online scams or fraud.
Please close this page.
Who am I to argue with that?
Jeff
Quote from: 'trout' pid='9425' dateline='1363147346'AMAZING a website for an international forgery operation :dash1:
These moungrels are the al-Queda of Numismatics and should be surgicaly removed via smart bombs A.S.A.P :aggressive:
I would be happy to push the button , but then i better not the owner of the factory is most likely using child labor and paying them sweet FA too , poor little buggas might be missing fingers from the presses and i bet they would be suffering chemical poisoning from the toxic metals they use.
If no one buys the fakes as gap fillers , then they won't make the crapola . :beg:
It might help if the customs would stop the fakes been imported into OZ too.
They must have heard Trout from way over there.!!:yahoo:
Quote from: 'Robster' pid='9434' dateline='1363151311'They must have heard Trout from way over there.!!:yahoo:
I must have a hidden microphone in my office; I was yelling out and uttering unmentionable profanities as I wrote my reply to this post.:angel:
Quote from: 'JeffH' pid='9432' dateline='1363150702'I went to have a look at the site and all I got was this.
QuoteDangerous Page
Address: http://www.jinghuashei.com/html/category/class_446.html
Trend Micro has confirmed that this website can transmit malicious software or has been involved in online scams or fraud.
Please close this page.
Who am I to argue with that?
Jeff
Doesnt come up when I open the page
I think the only ones that are half convincing are the 38 crown and 34/35 florin but even then theyre off. The copper is laughable, the 1915 florin is a shocker and I think the sovereign is even worse. I dont think they would fool many people, particularly anyone who had been collecting longer than a week.
I'm glad to see they have reasonable quality control in place though: http://www.jinghuashei.com/html/product/1006252320919012.html
Quote from: 'enworb' pid='9443' dateline='1363155714'I think the only ones that are half convincing are the 38 crown and 34/35 florin but even then theyre off. The copper is laughable, the 1915 florin is a shocker and I think the sovereign is even worse. I dont think they would fool many people, particularly anyone who had been collecting longer than a week.
don't tell them that or they will make better ones
although, i think that if it's not an exact copy then it's not quite as illegal
can we test that finger print :mocking:
:scratch_one-s_head: and trying to get custom to stop ANYTHING you'd be doin well, just look at the people and drugs they let in :scared:
:dodgy: looks suss to me http://www.ebay.com/itm/SUPERB-1914H-AUSTRALIAN-ONE-FLORIN-TWO-SHILLING-COIN-RARE-SILVER-/330902526163?pt=AU_Coins2&hash=item4d0b53d8d3
I can't see any wear on that coin at all Belly.
It's a fake
Its a chinese copy.
There has been a number of these dud 1914H florins on ebay lately.
One sold for $620 and another $1500.
They are all UNC and have been artificially toned.
I have sent a message to the seller :whistle2:
are these real or fake , please tell me .. thank you ?? ,, kel ,,
(http://i36.tinypic.com/vsj7h2.jpg)
(http://i33.tinypic.com/2qtwnf7.jpg)
(http://i37.tinypic.com/5363vb.jpg)
(http://i37.tinypic.com/o8tqa1.jpg)
(http://i37.tinypic.com/2vcx63l.jpg)
(http://i37.tinypic.com/o8tqa1.jpg)
(http://i33.tinypic.com/x277mp.jpg)
(http://i33.tinypic.com/21ez29d.jpg)
this is markings from the last one of them .. ,, kel ,,
(http://i35.tinypic.com/2uhnuvc.jpg)
this is the other coin tail side ..
now there should be 3 different heads and 3 different tail sides on these 3 19 23 aust half pennies .. ,, kel ,,
maybe a better view , ,, kel ,,
here's a couple of proof pics for you to compare your coins with kel
Coinworks has just sold the Proof 1923 Halfpenny for a world record price of $500,000. The only proof example of Australia’s rarest halfpenny available to collectors, the iconic copper was quickly snapped up by a prominent Sydney family"(2009)
(http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv93/ROBBIEWITHLUV/1964%20varieties/Australian-Proof-1923-Halfpenny_zps8e53fff9.jpg)
and here's a more worn one from Sterling and currency
(http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv93/ROBBIEWITHLUV/1964%20varieties/1923sterlingandcurrency_zps4e774097.jpg)(http://i673.photobucket.com/albums/vv93/ROBBIEWITHLUV/1964%20varieties/1923sterlingandcurrencyobv_zps0e258c51.jpg)
this is the blurb about fakes that Andrew has with the '23 information
Detecting Forgeries
When determining a coin’s authenticity, a sound starting point is to define the technical characteristics of that issue: Which obverse die was used? Which reverse die was used? What unique nuances does this coin have?
Obverse: Just one obverse hub or master die was used to create obverse dies for all halfpennies struck in Australia during the King George V period (between 1911 and 1936). The obverse die used to strike the 1916 "Mule" is of course rather different! The standard KGV obverse on Australian halfpennies exhibits the following features: 156 beads in rim; the last stroke of N in OMN is aligned between rim beads; the semicolon after IMP is aligned with the rim bead. (See photograph.)
Reverse: Prepared in Melbourne from London masters, with the numbers in the date re-punched in Melbourne. (See photograph.)
Nuances: The 2 in the date is typical of other coins struck using London sourced dies - there is a distinct vertical downward hook to the upper-left stroke. The upward flick on the right hand side of the base is also quite high relative to those struck later. The 3 in the date has a shorter, thicker bottom stroke to those struck elsewhere - it differs from those coins whose dates were re-punched with differently styled numbers. Only 25% of remaining specimens are completely devoid of die cracks, with the balance of 75% showing die cracks that fall into two distinct categories. (See photographs.)
thank you for your answers , the guy that owns these 3 x 1923 h/p had a bag with about 18 x 1923 h/p in it and wanted to give me the lot to show you all , but I said 3 was enough , and you could give me an answer from them . he has over 1000 pennies and h/p,s to look through , and said he was only half way through them so far .I will be reporting back to him on Tuesday, .
I just wish I could have given him some good news on them ,
no problems , better luck next time .. ,, kel ,,
hey kel
I am no 1923 expert - others here would have loads of knowledge about them over my knowledge
I just posted those bits here for you to look over -
I have a couple of 1923 halfpennies but got mine through our coin dealer and he is an expert on those older coins (so we trusted him to purchase from him)
if your friend has a genuine unchecked lot then they may very well be genuine
id reckon that 18 is quite a lot of 1923's from a lot of about 1,000 coins
but if it's a genuine lot - it might just happen to be very a lucky lot!
Quote from: 'keldaw' pid='12553' dateline='1366520473'are these real or fake , please tell me .. thank you ?? ,, kel ,,
(http://i36.tinypic.com/vsj7h2.jpg)
(http://i33.tinypic.com/2qtwnf7.jpg)
(http://i37.tinypic.com/5363vb.jpg)
(http://i37.tinypic.com/o8tqa1.jpg)
(http://i37.tinypic.com/2vcx63l.jpg)
(http://i37.tinypic.com/o8tqa1.jpg)
(http://i33.tinypic.com/x277mp.jpg)
(http://i33.tinypic.com/21ez29d.jpg)
this is markings from the last one of them .. ,, kel ,,
(http://i35.tinypic.com/2uhnuvc.jpg)
this is the other coin tail side ..
now there should be 3 different heads and 3 different tail sides on these 3 19 23 aust half pennies .. ,, kel ,,
maybe a better view , ,, kel ,,
Definitely fake. Looks like a real coin with an altered date.
I don't believe they're altered dates, they look like modern copies with artificial wear to me.
Just in case Robbie's proof '23 didn't get you drooling, here's another:
(http://images.numismatics.com.au/jpg/photos/user/r2956.jpg)
(http://images.numismatics.com.au/jpg/photos/user/r2966.jpg)
thanks guys , I go to see him tomorrow , ( Tuesday ) so I will show him the replys and the pic .
it does not really matter if it is a changed date or a fake copy coin ,he was just hoping it was the real thing ,.. thanks again for the replys .. ,, kel ,,
Walter,
You have to stop doing that.
My keyboard is going to fail soon from all the accumulated drool! :P
Jeff
thanks guys
I thought the '23's in kels' pics had funny looking '3's that seem to be leaning a little to the left (could be my over active imagination!)
I think you can also figure it out from the obverses too
I think that the 1933 is a fav for changing the first 3 to a 2 and the 1936 is another for changing the 6 to a '3'
I can't remember exactly but have been told about it
but, I do know that the 1923 is so fraught with fakes that you really have to know your stuff
there is a chance that in a lot of 18 X 1923's , just one might not be a forgery ? one can hope that they had a reference coin to copy
ok , I went over to his place today and showed him the errors on them 3 coins I put on the forum , I told him now you can go through all the others ,one at a time and go slowly , and study the 2 and the 3 in the dates , and let me know ..
,, kel ,,
Hi Kel, the three on that coin still looks somewhat larger and leaning compared to the pics of known genuines.!! Only my opinion of course.!!:dodgy: