I seen this on the RAM page and think it is about time they do something about all the presale items people have up on ebay.
https://eshop.ramint.gov.au/latest-news-with-desc.aspx?NewsID=216
Unauthorised drop shipping
21 Sep 2016
Recently a number of third-party groups have been participating in unauthorised drop shipping, meaning that groups are on-selling Royal Australian Mint products without stocking the items. This has resulted in confusion and misleading practices for our valued customers. Any orders suspected of drop-shipping will be terminated immediately and the purchase price refunded.
Please note, this practice is not authorised by the Royal Australian Mint and we will be unable to return or exchange products purchased via a third party company undertaking drop-shipping.
Royal Australian Mint products can be purchased directly via our retail channels or sourced from an authorised Coin Dealer. We list our authorised Coin Dealers here: https://www.ramint.gov.au/australian-dealers
All RAM has to do IF they are serious is to look through the eBay listings for pre sales and match that against their dealers list.
Anyone NOT on the list that is pre selling needs to be "Flagged" and action can be taken when they order :ok:
With the people that are associated with Cotton and Co (Who is a RAM dealer) who have been doing this "Drop Shopping" there may be a problem .
tricky
would be interesting to see how they could possibly police it
maybe just raising awareness for customers will in itself be the policing
wonder if this means 'pre-order' ?
never heard the term drop shipping before
found this
Startrack
Want to cut out the middleman and set up a streamlined online store? Drop shipping may be the way to go. It's a form of fulfilment where you don't actually keep any products in stock, and instead organise for products to go straight from the manufacturer or wholesaler to the customer.
Amazon is the world's most recognised drop shipper. At StarTrack, customers who routinely drop ship their orders include Wayfair, Ozsale and Catch of the Day. Then, there are thousands upon thousands of eBay stores that rely on drop shipping to get products from overseas manufacturers to consumers.
It's a great option if your online business is in its initial growth phase and lacks the capital to invest in inventory and/or warehouse space. It works for established businesses, too. Particularly if you sell larger items and the cost of shipping to a consolidation warehouse is prohibitive, or your manufacturer has holding locations close to your end customers.
How drop shipping works
Essentially, it's a five-step process:
1. Customer places order on retail website
2. Order is sent to wholesaler along with payment information
3. Wholesaler packages up the order and ships it to the customer, with the retailer's contact details and branding on the delivery docket
4. Customer receives the order
5. If needed, the retailer handles further enquiries or returns
This standard definition of drop shipping is a different model to store-to-door shipping (where the retailer dispatches products direct from a bricks and mortar store to a consumer) and zone skipping (where products are lodged in the state of delivery either from an Australian warehouse or an overseas source).
If you use the drop shipping model, you're still in charge of creating and maintaining an eCommerce website – and everything that comes with it, including marketing, sales and customer service. The big difference is that you don't stock any inventory, and thus don't worry about logistics and freight.
Advantages of drop shipping
Set up shop without much capital.
With drop shipping, you can bypass set-up costs like buying inventory and leasing warehouse space. That said, you'll still need enough start-up capital to create a winning website; and you'll need the t
https://www.startrack.com.au/articles/drop-shipping-what-is-it-and-should-you-use-it
Maybe RAM could have the listings removed from eBay in the first place :angel:
RAM should just open their own ebay store. A lot of real world retailers have an ebay presence.
Quote from: 'LooseChange' pid='98470' dateline='1474449530'RAM should just open their own ebay store. A lot of real world retailers have an ebay presence.
RAM can't keep up with demand as it is and they would be competing with their Dealer customers as well. :ok:
Quotecompeting with their Dealer customers as well
That doesn't seem to worry other private companies and we have been strongly assure the RAM is a private company (albeit with only one shareholder at present).
Not going to happen Jeff.
The Dealers are a Major part of their distribution network and RAM goes to some lengths to appease them eg sole distribution privileges for RAM rolls of coins.
I don't think that they would want to jeopardise this relationship by openly competing with them on eBay anytime soon :ok:
Anyway the dealers are a far more efficient option to buy RAM products from and they are usually at the same price as well. :)
i am not familiar with drop shipping
and I can't quite get my head around how ebay sellers are doing this
Quote from: 'robbiegal' pid='98478' dateline='1474452023'i am not familiar with drop shipping
and I can't quite get my head around how ebay sellers are doing this
Easy.
The sellers put up a listing for pre orders and when the item becomes available on the RAM Shop site they order the amount of coins pre ordered then post them to the buyers when they get the stock from RAM.
The don't actually have this stock "In Hand" and neither do they have a guarantee of supply from RAM.
Of course the prices asked are inflated because the "Pre Order" gives the buyer the false impression that their coins are "Guaranteed" to be supplied, Which in reality they are NOT :ok:
The authorised RAM dealers that offer a pre order DO have a guarantee of supply from RAM, The "Drop Sellers" don't :dodgy:
in the startrack express website it describes drop shipping as a situation where the seller does not even handle the product - the sellers arranges shipping direct from the warehouse
hence my confusion i.e. the RAM/ ebay and 'pre-order'
I am pretty sure that this has come about because of the rampant abuse by various eBay identities with the recent Olympic $2 coin issues, Including many instances of Pre Sale listings by Non Authorised RAM re sellers.
There were also multiple instances of unauthorised pre order listings with the 3 coin HM Birthday set as well.
As far as I can tell this "Drop Selling" of RAM products is a relatively New Phenomenon on eBay and it looks like RAM is pretty "Pissed" with it and are trying to nip it in the bud :ok:
DROP SHIPPING
Buy the product from a third party and the manufacturer sends to you direct.
Simple - has been going on for yeaes!
This is actually all a bit deceptive and confusing. Probably deliberately so.
Drop-shipping is an awesome development, only really made possible by computers and the internet. It saves time, money, risk and is much more environmentally friendly.
And it requires collaborative participation in the supply chain. Which is not a problem, since it benefits everyone.
There may be a slight increase in workload at the manufacturer's end, but this is likely offset by the gains, and perhaps a minor margin adjustment. And when you consider that with most manufacturing being in China, which can ship a package for 1/20th of what it costs us to ship, well, who wouldn't be in favour?
You can be certain that the RAM is not in any way involved in drop-shipping. Their anal attitudes towards the baggies and their insane postage charges are clear testament of how little regard they have for either the customer or efficiency.
Rather, they're talking about pre-orders here, and threatening to cancel any orders from people they suspect are engaged in it. Which is a crazy attitude, since pre-orders give an indication of demand, and result in less unsold inventory to clear, and increased profitability. Maybe they don't have any marketing or economics people on their staff?
Oh, and you COULD do drop-shipping, in a small way, simply by giving a different shipping address. It wouldn't scale, and would cause problems, not to mention being easy to counteract if it got out of hand, but its no different to sending someone a gift, really.
Anyway, to me its all a bit ho-hum. I'm sufficiently 'over' the RAM and their antics not to really care anymore, if I ever did.
QuoteDrop-shipping is an awesome development, only really made possible by computers and the internet. It saves time, money, risk and is much more environmentally friendly.
This may be so for normal household or industrial items that are mass produced and will and can be continually manufactured to meet the demand.
To do the same with the RAM products that have a "Limited" capacity to be manufactured to meet an increased demand and also have limitations on how many items it is allowed to produce is a recipe for disaster.
The uncontrolled Pre selling of RAM products has the capacity to sell more product than is actually produced and eventually there will be some customers that have paid "Up Front" that will be disappointed to say the very least :ok:
This "Shortfall" will not only reflect badly on the pre sale seller, There will also be a perception that RAM has failed in it's obligations as well and its reputation will be damaged in the process.
Quote from: 'trout' pid='98486' dateline='1474461236'This "Shortfall" will not only reflect badly on the pre sale seller, There will also be a perception that RAM has failed in it's obligations as well and its reputation will be damaged in the process.
Agreed.
I wasn't suggesting it was a good idea for collectibles, merely explaining it.
"This "Shortfall" will not only reflect badly on the pre sale seller, There will also be a perception that RAM has failed in it's obligations as well and its reputation will be damaged in the process."
meanwhile half of this forum is complaining about NOT receiving their RAM shop orders after month/s on end of waiting after payment has been taken from accounts
i think the RAM needs to up the anti on their own mail order sales practices as well
Quotei think the RAM needs to up the anti on their own mail order sales practices as well
:agreed:
Maybe the "Drop sellers" are the ones responsible for the tremendous backlog of orders at the RAM shop that is causing all these delays in shipping for us :angel:
Quote from: 'robbiegal' pid='98505' dateline='1474499841'"This "Shortfall" will not only reflect badly on the pre sale seller, There will also be a perception that RAM has failed in it's obligations as well and its reputation will be damaged in the process."
meanwhile half of this forum is complaining about NOT receiving their RAM shop orders after month/s on end of waiting after payment has been taken from accounts
i think the RAM needs to up the anti on their own mail order sales practices as well
Call me suspicious but I think this delay is intentional
If I was RAM and wanted to figure out who is responsible for drop shipping I would look on ebay, buy items that are not available yet from non authorised sellers. Then when people order the item hold onto all orders and then do a charge back with ebay for non supply. All they have to do then is wait to see who tries to cancel their order because they have lost the sale and cant afford to hold stock and BAM you have figured out who your drop shippers are and you can slap them with a ban or just target their items for delayed shipping in future
Best thing is it cost you no money as you will get the money back from ebay and you have artificially created demand for an item buy buying them off ebay for the presale prices
Probably too sly a procedure for the RAM and too many possible pitfalls (such as shitting off genuine customers who wait months for supply).
I have been waiting 5 weeks for my last order (available when I ordered but temporarily unavailable now). My previous order took 6 weeks. With that poor level of service I have joined the ranks of disaffected purchasers.
I would think that RAM would have enough "Clout" with eBay that if they requested that these unauthorised pre sale listings be removed then they would be.
Also if a particular seller insisted on relisting the pre sales that sanctions or even bans could be imposed on them if RAM pushed for them :ok:
It's not rocket science working out who the culprits are, All that is needed is to look on the RAM dealers list and if a particular pre sale seller isn't on that list then have the listing removed and all sales cancelled .
I just put "Pre Order" into the search tab on eBay, NO surprises here with 13 separate pre order listings for RAM and RBA products.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/PRE-SALE-Australia-2016-2-PARALYMPIC-TEAM-COLOR-1st-Multi-Colour-2-/112083002503?hash=item1a18aae487:g:E4UAAOSwJqpXoURb
and another two.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/BULK-10-x-2016-Two-Dollar-2-Australian-Paralympic-Team-PRE-ORDER-/252551114165?hash=item3acd382db5:g:pXsAAOSw6WdXi1zf
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/2016-2-Australian-Paralympic-Team-Coin-PRE-ORDER-/182275695493?hash=item2a707a6385:g:aAsAAOSwMtxXrDkz
tricky
remembering that customers PAY in advance as well - so they have to get their money back from the cancelled sales - if the paypal account is empty then that could be tricky
the RAM will need to start imposing some sort of copyright?
it would have to be on their packaged products i suppose
ebay could just stop all pre-orders from being made with all sellers
that would solve it altogether
a heck of a lot of the ram authorised dealerships aren't exactly kosher in my books anyways and I may choose to not have to deal with some of them as a matter of my own previous experience with bad service and nasty communications and so on
under fair trade practices we shouldn't be forced into having to buy only from the authorised dealers ?
if taken to the n'th degree then maybe the selling on (actual products) for small time hobbyists like myself could also end up being squished? most years i sell on a handful of ram products - (i never go crazy like some who sell hundreds) - i have always had a bit of fun, gather some returns that helps me to buy more coin crap, to keep and sell and so on
i do believe that the ebay 'pre-orders' for the olympic coin sets and single paralympic coin were almost ridiculous as you could buy them through the RAM and if access to a local Woolworth then you stood a chance to grab some there.
perhaps the whole business reflects the fact that the RAM has cornered the collector market but in having achieved that so quickly they haven't developed the infrastructure to support the distribution to meet demand. they run the mint on the scant level of staffing that reflects the 1980's cutbacks and/or redundancies and they continue to run the place as if it is still 1985.
you can 'pre-order' the $5 new generations folder
must admit that this seller has multiple listings and the listings seem to imply an association with the RBA - which i think promotes a certain level of confidence for the buyer
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Australia-2016-Two-Generation-5-RBA-Folder-2-x-5-Note-VIDEO-BELOW-Pre-order-/112116945877?hash=item1a1ab0d3d5:g:PKwAAOSwi0RXx~Pd
Quote from: 'robbiegal' pid='98517' dateline='1474508482'perhaps the whole business reflects the fact that the RAM has cornered the collector market but in having achieved that so quickly they haven't developed the infrastructure to support the distribution to meet demand. they run the mint on the scant level of staffing that reflects the 1980's cutbacks and/or redundancies and they continue to run the place as if it is still 1985.
OK. If they wouldn't mind knocking out a few 1985 20c and 50c for me that would be good. :biggrin:
Pedro
ha ha
i think that 1983 $1 might also be good to add in with that lot?
I usually get all my RAM product from Onlinecoinslismore and have had absolutely NO problems with postage or with problematic coins :good:
However certain RAM releases are either unavailable via an authorised RAM reseller or some releases from RAM have to be ordered directly from the RAM Shop to ensure that I can get the item before they sell out.
I have had problems with a couple of the authorised RAM suppliers with lousy shipping times in the past But on a whole these RAM Dealers are a far far better option than some shonky eBay seller anyday :ok:
:i_agree::yeah_that::agreed:
I have just sent an email to Dion Buck at RAM and have included the links to these "Drop Sales" listings.
Lets see if any action is taken regarding these :angel:
personally
i don't think they are drop sales
as the items aren't sent from the RAM to the ebay customer/buyer
the item goes
ebay seller buys from RAM - RAM posts to ebay seller - items are delivered to that person - then the ebay seller repackages and posts
if i have it right (unlikely but ...)
a drop shipping sale is
ebay seller sells item - seller sends order to RAM - RAM packages and post to the customer (not the ebay seller)
Quote from: 'robbiegal' pid='98525' dateline='1474512638'personally
i don't think they are drop sales
as the items aren't sent from the RAM to the ebay customer/buyer
the item goes
ebay seller buys from RAM - RAM posts to ebay seller - items are delivered to that person - then the ebay seller repackages and posts
if i have it right (unlikely but ...)
a drop shipping sale is
ebay seller sells item - seller sends order to RAM - RAM packages and post to the customer (not the ebay seller)
These are EXACTLY the type of sellers that RAM is referring to RG :ok:
Quote from: 'robbiegal' pid='98525' dateline='1474512638'a drop shipping sale is
ebay seller sells item - seller sends order to RAM - RAM packages and post to the customer (not the ebay seller)
Yes, that's the sort of thing they are referring to. I can imagine that the RAM has all sorts of legal problems with this. Basically the eBay seller is impersonating someone else on the mint eShop and the RAM's contractual status with the end collector is very murky.