(http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc462/joseywales10/1927c%202_zpsq5eqx0wt.jpg)
(http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc462/joseywales10/1927c%201_zps1p27djez.jpg)
(http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc462/joseywales10/1927c%201x_zpsyhpuswzf.jpg)
First die clashed Canberra I've seen.
Interesting obverse effect.
I'm wondering if the darker circle is associated with the clash or PMD ?
Gee that's a beauty and it's got a nice orb and just a nice coin all round echi, well done :good: but don't know what to make of the ring so maybe someone else may have seen a similar thing before.
yep
i have a one and only as well
Trout probably has about 50 but hasn't found them yet
trout's at work so it might be a few days before he can post any pic's.
Nice one. :)
I can't say that I have noticed this before, We are talking about the area in front of the Kings nose ??
This looks like a pretty new obverse die as there are no die cracks at all in the legends and I am not sure what caused the "halo" effect But it could be due to being stored with a smaller coin maybe a half penny??
I will have a look at some of my Canberra's when I get home But I can't recall seeing this before :ok:
Is that the same die clash florin that finished a week or so on fleabay? I bid on that coin higher than the grade deserved because of the die clash (but didn't win as obviously others also saw the clash).
Bare with me guys I have one of these what are we looking at with regards a die clash, new to this
the die clash is around the king's nose
it is bits and bobs the building from the reverse
going by memory of the one that I have, you need to turn the coin upside down to see it in context
Here's an overlay of Echi's coin images.
I probably needed to rotate one of them a couple of degrees but the overlay serves the purpose.
With a quick look you can see the reverse pattern on the obverse indicated by the arrow in the bottom pic.
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/11067/echi1927.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/11067/echi1927z.jpg)
wow
how do you do that?
i just found my coin and marks off the clash area for the new poster too
may as well still post them!
side by side - the clash on these coins ise almost identical
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10035/P9130669_-_Copy.JPG)(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10035/P9130670_-_Copy.JPG)(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10035/P9130664_-_Copy.JPG)
Quote from: 'Unicorn' pid='97912' dateline='1473806731'Here's an overlay of Echi's coin images.
I probably needed to rotate one of them a couple of degrees but the overlay serves the purpose.
With a quick look you can see the reverse pattern on the obverse indicated by the arrow in the bottom pic.
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/11067/echi1927.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/11067/echi1927z.jpg)
Nice one RG! That certainly confirms the error.
(I just used photostudio to flip the reverse then make a composite image of the two ...... the perfectionist in me wanted to play with getting the alignment exact, but spare time is not my friend at the moment :laugh2:).
Nice clash and good photoshop work Uni.
Thanks UNI for the overlay.
And thanks Robbie for posting your pics.
Quote from: 'tonymac' pid='97909' dateline='1473804474'Bare with me guys I have one of these what are we looking at with regards a die clash, new to this
Do a little searching and you'll find several die clash threads. It happens fairly often.
Clashes occur when a press misfeeds and there is no planchet between the dies when they strike. The dies hit each other, and part of the design transfers. Because the design is cut into the die, so the high points on the coin are the low points on the die, it is protected from damage. The field, however, is the surface of the die, and so the edges of the design are the bits that transfer onto the opposing die's field.
"Why doesn't the entire design transfer?", I hear you ask. Well, it would if the dies were absolutely perfectly aligned. But there is a tiny bit of leeway when dies are inserted into the press, and they may be sitting very slightly angled. You would never notice this on a coin
(well, unless the angle was hugely off, but that's another matter). But even a tiny angle is enough for one part of the dies to clash and not another.
Also, depending on the relative hardness of the two dies, the design may transfer onto one or both dies. The 5¢ I posted recently shows a clash on both sides for instance.
Thanks Mark and my pleasure Echi, I love a good error.
Excellent pic's Uni and RG :good:
Quote from: 'Fulvio' pid='97925' dateline='1473817078'"Why doesn't the entire design transfer?", I hear you ask. Well, it would if the dies were absolutely perfectly aligned. But there is a tiny bit of leeway when dies are inserted into the press, and they may be sitting very slightly angled. You would never notice this on a coin (well, unless the angle was hugely off, but that's another matter). But even a tiny angle is enough for one part of the dies to clash and not another.
Dies often do not have their designs about a flat plane but along a slight convex dome, which is another reason you often see die clash on the center part of the die only.
Quote from: 'markn' pid='97934' dateline='1473825872'Dies often do not have their designs about a flat plane but along a slight convex dome, which is another reason you often see die clash on the center part of the die only.
Production dies for circulating coins? Well, y'learn something new every day. :)
Some pics would be nice.
Quote from: 'Fulvio' pid='97938' dateline='1473828092'Production dies for circulating coins?
My understanding is that the dome helps to force the metal of the planchet evenly and radially towards the rim.
QuoteSome pics would be nice.
If you mean pics of the dome, that could be tricky since its very small, something of the order of a thousandth of an inch.
Quote from: 'r9453' pid='97979' dateline='1473870897'Quote from: 'Fulvio' pid='97938' dateline='1473828092'Production dies for circulating coins?
My understanding is that the dome helps to force the metal of the planchet evenly and radially towards the rim.
QuoteSome pics would be nice.
If you mean pics of the dome, that could be tricky since its very small, something of the order of a thousandth of an inch.
Yep, what he said :) It's the reason so called "die adjustment strikes" usually only show evidence of the striking in the center of the coin even though the areas of highest relief are often not in those regions.
Quote from: 'Fulvio' pid='97925' dateline='1473817078'Quote from: 'tonymac' pid='97909' dateline='1473804474'Bare with me guys I have one of these what are we looking at with regards a die clash, new to this
Do a little searching and you'll find several die clash threads. It happens fairly often.
Clashes occur when a press misfeeds and there is no planchet between the dies when they strike. The dies hit each other, and part of the design transfers. Because the design is cut into the die, so the high points on the coin are the low points on the die, it is protected from damage. The field, however, is the surface of the die, and so the edges of the design are the bits that transfer onto the opposing die's field.
"Why doesn't the entire design transfer?", I hear you ask. Well, it would if the dies were absolutely perfectly aligned. But there is a tiny bit of leeway when dies are inserted into the press, and they may be sitting very slightly angled. You would never notice this on a coin (well, unless the angle was hugely off, but that's another matter). But even a tiny angle is enough for one part of the dies to clash and not another.
Also, depending on the relative hardness of the two dies, the design may transfer onto one or both dies. The 5¢ I posted recently shows a clash on both sides for instance.
Thanks Fulvio the learning curve is becoming more of a slope
Quote from: 'tonymac' pid='97988' dateline='1473896309'Thanks Fulvio the learning curve is becoming more of a slope
Awesome! Wait till it levels off with the odd bump here and there. ;)
From the images of echidna's and RG's coins I can assume that I won't have to search through any of my Canberra's with die cracks on the obverse as there are none on the 2 different coins posted.
I will also be able to overlook any coin under EF as the clash will be too hard to see properly so that leaves only about 80-100 to look through I think, Not sure.
I have just got home from driving about 800k's and I am buggered so I will start the search tomorrow and hope fully I may be able to find one of these clashed specimens :ok:
yep you might
i am not real big on the PH florin but have probably owned or sold about 100 - 140 of them over the years - so for me, my tally is about 1 in 100 - 140
Quote from: 'robbiegal' pid='98017' dateline='1473933732'yep you might
i am not real big on the PH florin but have probably owned or sold about 100 - 140 of them over the years - so for me, my tally is about 1 in 100 - 140
But were you actually looking for this clash before :)
I spend so much time looking at the orbs, ear and other high points on these coins and only give the fields a cursory glance to look for hits, nicks, abrasions and lustre that I could have well overlooked this somewhat feint clash that I imagine will only be obvious looking at the coin from different angles and lighting. :ok:
nope, i wasn't util i found one - hadn't seen the clash before
this one posted is only the second one that i have seen a photo of
Quote from: 'nealeffendi' pid='97906' dateline='1473803698'Is that the same die clash florin that finished a week or so on fleabay? I bid on that coin higher than the grade deserved because of the die clash (but didn't win as obviously others also saw the clash).
I just checked, yep it's the Monatarium Canberra ebay item 262591394638 that sold for $95
I just finished looking through my coins, I even checked the slabbed ones, Nothing, Nada, Zilch :(
I just looked through a couple of hundred "Culls" and Bingo I found three :)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10019/clash.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10019/clash1.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10019/clash2.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10019/clash3.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10019/clash4.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10019/clash5.jpg)
Nice ones Troutski!
Note the first two have the die crack through top of GIV (like RG's) whereas the last hasn't (like Echi's).
Joy to the world of error collecting.
Quote from: 'trout' pid='98064' dateline='1473991200'I just looked through a couple of hundred "Culls" and Bingo I found three :)
Nice. Just as well you hadn't tossed 'em, eh? :angel:
Quote from: 'Fulvio' pid='98071' dateline='1473992913'Quote from: 'trout' pid='98064' dateline='1473991200'I just looked through a couple of hundred "Culls" and Bingo I found three :)
Nice. Just as well you hadn't tossed 'em, eh? :angel:
I don't think I have ever "Tossed" a Canberra florin Old Mate :)
I have NO idea of the number of obverse dies that were available for this coin But I don't imagine that there were an indefinite number considering the mintage was only 2 mill and the obverse design was a "One Off" as far as Australian coins are concerned and minor "imperfections" were probably ignored in order to lengthen the die life.
The numerous coins around with die cracks on the obverse legends tend to support that theory.
This leads me to believe that this "Clash" may be relatively easy to find as it isn't THAT noticeable and I imagine that many would have escaped before the die was cleaned up to remove the offending clashing.
Also with such a small sample of coins producing 5 of these errors it looks like they may be quite plentiful and most collectors should be able to get one of these for their error sets without breaking the bank :good:
Nicely spotted Echi, Well done Mate :yahoo:
I have just gone through my 8 or 9 coins and nil finds.
Quote from: 'Goldseeker' pid='98148' dateline='1474079745'I have just gone through my 8 or 9 coins and nil finds.
I went through about 400 to find my 3 coins, Out of a mintage of 2 mill 400 is NOT an large sample.
i posted pics of my die clashed 1927 PH florin here a couple of years ago
no body else here at the time had one or had seen one