Will the seemingly increased growth in third party graded coins (TPG's) eventually be a boon to those who stick with their so called raw coins. As time moves on and the task of seeking those ideal examples for slabbing becomes more difficult due to an ever dwindling supply of quality raw coins, the value of such coins worthy of slabbing (CWOS) must surely increase.
All things considered and coupled with the apparent high cost involved in the slabbing process along with slashed current values, as well as increased risk due to the lack of a local franchise, are those in possession of CWOS better off keeping them in their saflips and waiting for that rainy day?
I would imagine that there are many many "CWOS" (what a great term) in the older collectors hands and these will "trickle" out onto the market eventually.
TPG graded coins in Australia is still a tiny part of the market unlike it is in the US and Canada, But it IS catching on a lot of this is due to the amount of fake/counterfeit coins out there and the practice of over graded and cleaned coins being sold to the unweary.
I agree that there Must be a hidden wealth of top quality coins quietly sitting in albums, boxes and even knickers draws around the country just waiting to be discovered, the trick is how do we find these treasures??
The quest for high value raw coins is continuous but the true value for me cannot be known until they are
slabbed as there can be a fine line between rare and common with some graded issues and not many of us
are able to see that line so raw coins will always be relatively cheaper in my view
Downies latest catalogue have a few PCGS Slabbed coins and the prices asked for are quite amazing.
Maybe if one has some good coins and got them slabbed, then the prices achieved could be quite rewarding.
I have noticed that since PCGS/NGC coins have become more "Acceptable" to collectors Many sellers on eBay are pricing their coins at the same value as the TPG coins.
I am basing this on what I have seen happening to the BIN prices asked for raw Canberra florins on eBay over the last 6-12 months.
Like Steve said the PCGS/NGC coin will sell better than a raw coin at the same price simply because it is what it is graded at and there is NO risk of the coin being a lesser grade/cleaned or even fake with the TPG coin.
Back to the original idea with stashing away a few "CWOS" raw in saflips.
Why would you bother when you could have it graded then stash it away for a rainy day?
That way it would be better protected (The new PCGS slabs are "Air Tight" ) and when you do eventually go to sell it the process will be so much easier than if you left it raw :ok:
CWOS are out there, you just needs to spend a huge amount of time hunting them. most people are better of just opening their check book up as their time is better spent earning money. but for some of us its all about the hunt! I have spent hours flipping through coin dealers/collectors files at coin shows looking for CWOS and love it when I find a gem
Many collections were put together during the 60s and 70s.
Most were average, some top quality.
When these old time collections appear much interest is generated.
And the quest for top pop coins becomes a feeding frenzy at some auctions.
We all know what the rare and scarce dates are.
But PCGS numbers will eventually show what are the conditional rarities.
There will be surprises I reckon.
I'm not a big fan of flips for long term storage.
The plastic is hard and will rub the high points over time especially if the rims are low.
Sort of like cabinet friction.
The soft 2x2s are better I think.
Excellent points of view everyone. There must be a large number of collectors out there who hold such examples, and I reckon this subject would have touched their thoughts at some time or other.
Quote from: 'echidna' pid='82091' dateline='1448968165'I'm not a big fan of flips for long term storage.
The plastic is hard and will rub the high points over time especially if the rims are low.
Sort of like cabinet friction.
The soft 2x2s are better I think.
I agree,seen too many coins,esp Silver,with a crescent mark from the tongue tucked in to the flip itself.
I always use adhesive 2x2's with a staple or 2 for long term storage,haven't had a problem so far.
I have some C(maybe)WOF but have not had any slabbed. One of my coins I gave to a fellow forum member was slabbed and came back MS62. At that grade It is not really worth the cost to have a 1966 50¢ slabbed. A second one in the same submission came back UNC details, cleaned -we both thought that was the better coin of the two.
I am happy to just sit and wait. Might get some sent off one day if I think I do have any worth the exercise. Studying PCGS photos (and some of trout's) I am thinking that I could be too severe with some of my grading estimates. I notice some with minor rim dents have obtained good grades and I tend to put similar ones down because of that.
All a learning exercise.
Quote from: 'JeffH' pid='82107' dateline='1449008206'I have some C(maybe)WOF but have not had any slabbed. One of my coins I gave to a fellow forum member was slabbed and came back MS62. At that grade It is not really worth the cost to have a 1966 50¢ slabbed. A second one in the same submission came back UNC details, cleaned -we both thought that was the better coin of the two.
I am happy to just sit and wait. Might get some sent off one day if I think I do have any worth the exercise. Studying PCGS photos (and some of trout's) I am thinking that I could be too severe with some of my grading estimates. I notice some with minor rim dents have obtained good grades and I tend to put similar ones down because of that.
All a learning exercise.
Finding a 1966 50 cent coin in MS64 and higher is pretty hard due to these coins being treated as Bullion and looked after accordingly, that is just chucked into buckets and bags without any concern for the coin itself :dash1:
Most of us have fallen into the trap of looking at our collections and seeing a coin that stands out above the others and naturally assuming that is has to be a High grade coin In most cases this is Not so, Been there done that :s
The most important thing to consider before sending any coins to a TPG is to grade them accurately don't just send them because you think they look "Nice", Give them a real GOOD looking over and be Impartial as failure to do this normally leads to disaster.. Been there done that as well :cray::dash1:
Yes I have done the 1966 50 cent run myself looking for the elusive MS66 but have ended up with
grades from MS62 to MS65.Now I have some slabbed coins for reference and I won't send anything
over that I think will achieve anything less than MS64 and as Jeff said it's a learning exercise
Talking of CWOS, I have two 1930 pennies, two 1923 halfpennies, two 1921/22 threepences and a 1966 20c Wavey Line.
These coins are forming the backbone of my collection and one each of pennies, halfpennies and threepences have been certified as genuine by the RAM and I have the papers to show this as well as the photos taken by the RAM of these three coins.
Now, the question is, regardless of the grades of these coins, should I get them slabbed.
Further, who on this forum would take on the task of sending them away for me if I pay for the costs.
TIA for any comments, recommendations etc that may be forthcoming.
Quote from: 'Goldseeker' pid='82133' dateline='1449053041'Talking of CWOS, I have two 1930 pennies, two 1923 halfpennies, two 1921/22 threepences and a 1966 20c Wavey Line.
These coins are forming the backbone of my collection and one each of pennies, halfpennies and threepences have been certified as genuine by the RAM and I have the papers to show this as well as the photos taken by the RAM of these three coins.
Now, the question is, regardless of the grades of these coins, should I get them slabbed.
Further, who on this forum would take on the task of sending them away for me if I pay for the costs.
TIA for any comments, recommendations etc that may be forthcoming.
If it were me I would definately get the 1930 pennies PCGS graded at least.
Eric is very good and cost would be about $150 each.
Quote from: 'Goldseeker' pid='82133' dateline='1449053041'Talking of CWOS, I have two 1930 pennies, two 1923 halfpennies, two 1921/22 threepences and a 1966 20c Wavey Line.
These coins are forming the backbone of my collection and one each of pennies, halfpennies and threepences have been certified as genuine by the RAM and I have the papers to show this as well as the photos taken by the RAM of these three coins.
Now, the question is, regardless of the grades of these coins, should I get them slabbed.
Further, who on this forum would take on the task of sending them away for me if I pay for the costs.
TIA for any comments, recommendations etc that may be forthcoming.
Hey GS,
You can use someone like Eric or Walter to send the coins to PCGS. If you are in Melbourne, Walters office is in the city... worth grading your coins :yahoo:
Thanks Ausproofs, I have used Walter before with my Mules to be slabbed.
I had no problems with him at all.
All I need is a contact phone number and address.
Quote from: 'Goldseeker' pid='82139' dateline='1449054144'Thanks Ausproofs, I have used Walter before with my Mules to be slabbed.
I had no problems with him at all.
All I need is a contact phone number and address.
PM sent with the details...
Quote from: 'Goldseeker' pid='82133' dateline='1449053041'Talking of CWOS, I have two 1930 pennies, two 1923 halfpennies, two 1921/22 threepences and a 1966 20c Wavey Line.
These coins are forming the backbone of my collection and one each of pennies, halfpennies and threepences have been certified as genuine by the RAM and I have the papers to show this as well as the photos taken by the RAM of these three coins.
Now, the question is, regardless of the grades of these coins, should I get them slabbed.
Further, who on this forum would take on the task of sending them away for me if I pay for the costs.
TIA for any comments, recommendations etc that may be forthcoming.
I would love to send your coins to PCGS for you But I would rather not , It won't be cheap as these coins have to be sent in the expensive area as far as submissions go .
Up to $65 USD each (with the good images) plus postage there and back.
For 6 coins sent "Express" (Max coin value $20,000) about $400 USD for PCGS and about $70 insured to post from Aus.
With the exchange rate the way it is at the moment you won't get much change out of $600 AUD.
This is at cost :ok:
I would much prefer that you sent them via Eric Eigner, Andrew Crellin or any other trusted dealer They do offer this service and I would prefer not to do this just in case 1 or more of the coins come back "Counterfeit" as this would only cause "Bad Blood" :ok:
I have sent coins away for other members here with my submissions with success But nothing of this calibre :ok:
This is just giving you a rough estimate of what you would be up for getting your coins graded :ok:
All comments appreciated and appropriate enquiries will be made.
Many thanks one and all.
Quote from: 'Goldseeker' pid='82189' dateline='1449193103'All comments appreciated and appropriate enquiries will be made.
Many thanks one and all.
I would seriously consider getting these graded Bruce as there are a plethora of fakes out there and regardless of the grades achieved when they come back they will at least be attributed as "Genuine" by PCGS and that is accepted Worldwide :ok:
Quote from: 'echidna' pid='82091' dateline='1448968165'I'm not a big fan of flips for long term storage.
The plastic is hard and will rub the high points over time especially if the rims are low.
Sort of like cabinet friction.
The soft 2x2s are better I think.
But wouldn't the soft 2x2s risk PVC goo or out gassing problems with long term storage? Or are you talking about the mylar-cardboard ones? I stopped using them as they put cardboard dust on the coins and the glued sides always seem to let coins fall out or let the coin come part way out to get the face stuck to glue. Also how safe is the glue?
How do you rate Saflips? I must have 100+ slab worthy coins in them plus another 500+ Not Quite Slab Worthy Coins (NQSWCs) in them. No way will I get those 500+ holiday in California.
What about the generic acrylic cases? They are not as cheap as Saflips or 2x2s ($1-3 each) but might be a non TPG option for the NQSWCs.
Or Eagle Shields or any other similar product?
Quote from: 'trout' pid='82143' dateline='1449055007'Quote from: 'Goldseeker' pid='82133' dateline='1449053041'Talking of CWOS, I have two 1930 pennies, two 1923 halfpennies, two 1921/22 threepences and a 1966 20c Wavey Line.
These coins are forming the backbone of my collection and one each of pennies, halfpennies and threepences have been certified as genuine by the RAM and I have the papers to show this as well as the photos taken by the RAM of these three coins.
Now, the question is, regardless of the grades of these coins, should I get them slabbed.
Further, who on this forum would take on the task of sending them away for me if I pay for the costs.
TIA for any comments, recommendations etc that may be forthcoming.
I would love to send your coins to PCGS for you But I would rather not , It won't be cheap as these coins have to be sent in the expensive area as far as submissions go .
Up to $65 USD each (with the good images) plus postage there and back.
For 6 coins sent "Express" (Max coin value $20,000) about $400 USD for PCGS and about $70 insured to post from Aus.
With the exchange rate the way it is at the moment you won't get much change out of $600 AUD.
This is at cost :ok:
I would much prefer that you sent them via Eric Eigner, Andrew Crellin or any other trusted dealer They do offer this service and I would prefer not to do this just in case 1 or more of the coins come back "Counterfeit" as this would only cause "Bad Blood" :ok:
I have sent coins away for other members here with my submissions with success But nothing of this calibre :ok:
This is just giving you a rough estimate of what you would be up for getting your coins graded :ok:
Thanks for the plug, trout. Also, if you send it through these dealers, they will let you know beforehand if anything is cleaned or damaged in some way. If the dealer only saves you from sending one coin over to PCGS from each batch, then you're already ahead.
Eric
Eric is correct
I know from experience drakesterling appraises them before sending to PCGS and lets you know if the coin will be rejected and won't submit just send it back to you
QuoteThanks for the plug, trout
No worries Mate, I have only heard good things from people that have sent coins to you to be graded :good:
Let us know if you decide to have your CWOS graded Goldie.
If you do decide to go ahead with this I wish you well and am looking forward to seeing the PCGS images of these iconic Aussie coins .
Would this be considered a Coin Worthy Of Slabbing?
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10055/1939_12F2d_1.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10055/1939_12F2d_2.jpg)
Quote from: 'JeffH' pid='82242' dateline='1449365796'Would this be considered a Coin Worthy Of Slabbing?
Nice coin but not worth slabbing
Wont grade high enough IMO
Thanks chaps.
I would not put it any more than a low EF grade. Shocking how poor it looks in a high resolution scan compared to "in the hand"!
Well, back to the folder with all his compatriots.
Cool thread, you can ask Trout, Stevo and Belly I've been talking about sleepers for years, they're out there just waiting to be found so I don't have much faith in a lot of top of the pop unless it's a MS/PR70 then there can't be better :winkextra:
hey AJ
I kept some NZ coins for you from my trip - tried to hang onto the shiny ones
not worthy of slabbing but friend's keepers for a world coins collector!
Oh excellent thank you so very much RG, your a sweetheart :give_heart:
I collected this some time ago because of the left tilted 4. Thinking lately of maybe sending it to a TPG, and now wondering if I'm wasting my time because of the reverse planchet flaw? Didn't consider it to be a negative at the time :dash1: It was a split grade of gEF/aUNC. Opinions appreciated :)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10064/1914_Penny_rev__Left_tilted_4.JPG)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10064/1914_Penny_obv__Left_tilted_4.JPG)
I'd say its borderline as to whether they will grade it.
If they do they will deduct points for the flaw.
My guess is 58 - 2 points = 53
I'm not so sure it's a Pl.Flaw. Looks like a cud on the N to me.
I reckon it will slip through
Just aquired these 2 and was wondering if poeple considered these worth slabbing
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10137/muled.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10137/mule_c.jpg)
coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10137/mule_a.jpg[/img]
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10137/mule_b.jpg)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10137/mule_a.jpg)
They look in reasonable nick and the first one is reasonably well centred. So at a potential selling price in the range of $500 to $800, depending on actual grade achieved, the slabbing cost is likely worth it.
I find it hard to estimate grades of $1 coins from a photo -have you considered what they may grade?
Quote from: 'JeffH' pid='103940' dateline='1484281984'They look in reasonable nick and the first one is reasonably well centred. So at a potential selling price in the range of $500 to $800, depending on actual grade achieved, the slabbing cost is likely worth it.
I find it hard to estimate grades of $1 coins from a photo -have you considered what they may grade?
I'd say they would grade between VF30 to XF45 but mid range dollars can go either
way I'd say
Quote from: 'echidna' pid='103924' dateline='1484273892'I'd say its borderline as to whether they will grade it.
If they do they will deduct points for the flaw.
My guess is 58 - 2 points = 53
Thanks echidna, I might risk it
Quote from: 'Nevol' pid='103925' dateline='1484274682'I'm not so sure it's a Pl.Flaw. Looks like a cud on the N to me.
It is a flaw Nevol, the flap is still in place
Quote from: 'stevo1962' pid='103927' dateline='1484276226'I reckon it will slip through
Thanks stevo, and that first mule of yours looks better than gVF to me
Appreciate any thoughts on these. 1931 Indian dropped 1, 1942I with missing mm. Would the toning on the 31, and the heavier toning on the 42 prevent them from being CWOS? TIA
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10064/1931_Penny_Dropped_1_rev__Indian_obv_.JPG)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10064/1931_Penny_Indian_obv__Dropped_1_rev_.JPG)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10064/1942I_Penny_rev__Missing_I.JPG)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10064/1942I_Penny_obv__Missing_I.JPG)
The 42 looks gradable to me.
2 points for the streaky tone though.
Dunno about the 31.
I'd just send both in if they were mine.
I like the 31 - very nice coin despite the uneven tone/colour.
Envious of the 31, mate. Nice looking coin.
Quote from: 'echidna' pid='103979' dateline='1484443415'
Quote from: 'gnome' pid='103980' dateline='1484443699'
Thanks for the feedback Guys
The other list is equally impressive. :)
Thanks G. Most are from ebay, but in a weak moment I did pay for a couple of others :blink:
I've got quantity instead of the quality, mainly lower grade ones. Still missing the 31 and one or two of the 20's. Pain in the butt to try and keep sorted at times. :)
These are before and after pics of the progress of a coin I've had sitting on the window sill for a few months in an attempt to engineer a more even tone.
I think it may have suffered PVC damage, and displays a different tone ring through the entire legend.
Interested in opinions of its chances of ever being acceptable to the third party graders, PCGS etc.
TIA
(https://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10064/270/1922_penny_obv_group_2_common_width_date_upright_9.jpg)
(https://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10064/270/1922_Penny_obv__Upright_9_common_width_date_reverse.JPG)
Looks 50/50 to me, based on the pics
I would just send it...
What date is it by the way ?
Thanks echidna. This is the reverse. Probably doesn't generate huge interest, but it's a common width date with the upright 9, much scarcer than the narrow or wide dates IMO.
(https://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10064/270/1922_penny_rev_group_2_common_width_date_upright_9.jpg)