It seems currently circulating Greek euro coins and sets are the last ones ever. Perhaps the value is now increasing? Does anyone have a mint set for sale?
We still have absolutely no idea what the next step is going to be for Greece and the Eurozone. The markets and the euro are tanking simply because of the uncertainty, and there's uncertainty because right now, everyone is just making stuff up as they go along. Economists hate it when people don't follow the rulebook, but there is no rulebook people are following, because the people that designed the euro never imagined that a Eurozone country would do what Greece has been doing. In that sense, the euro was badly designed.
For the record: I pointed out, in an article I wrote for my coin club magazine way back when the euro formed, that there didn't seem to be any mechanism for countries to secede from the euro, short of actually declaring war.
or surrendering from that said war
Quote from: 'Sapyx' pid='75303' dateline='1436187525'We still have absolutely no idea what the next step is going to be for Greece and the Eurozone. The markets and the euro are tanking simply because of the uncertainty, and there's uncertainty because right now, everyone is just making stuff up as they go along. Economists hate it when people don't follow the rulebook, but there is no rulebook people are following, because the people that designed the euro never imagined that a Eurozone country would do what Greece has been doing. In that sense, the euro was badly designed.
For the record: I pointed out, in an article I wrote for my coin club magazine way back when the euro formed, that there didn't seem to be any mechanism for countries to secede from the euro, short of actually declaring war.
When EU was formed and I saw what was happening and talking to people in Europe, i predicted there will be a day in the future when Germany will again have their DM rather than Euro (to stay within the context of coins and currency). Many people thought that it is impossible but the possibility of Greece taking Drachma back is towards that.
What about the other currency unions, the East Caribbean dollar went through the Grenada war, and tension with Cuba and the US, West and Central CFA Francs are weathering corruption, war, economic collapse, but has had some devaluation. But they are tied to other currencies and their economies amount to a small fraction of trade, mainly coca, coffee and tourism.
What I'm saying it is all just people getting scared, thats all.
It is rather complex economically regarding currency unions as it does limit currency movements substantially which is exceptionally important when it comes to international economics and gaining both internal and external economic balance. In short it is a very long explanation in general however if you want to ask specific questions I can attempt to explain it rather succinctly.
Overall in terms of Greece there is no way out for them except leaving the Euro Zone (hyper devaluation of their new currency so bad for them) or going Bankrupt (in this case bad for the entire European Union.)
In short Greece has had absolutely no concept of economics in any way, shape or form for many many years.
The discussion has shifted to economics and that way side swipes politics as well. This is an interesting subject and hopefully the moderators allow more discussion, it relates to money in some way.
From the beginning the EU was an ambitious project and in my opinion it was "coined" by socialists and power hungry politicians. It sounds mad trying to bring together countries that are so different in how they are structured and their political and operational principles, like Greece and Germany. It was no surprise that sparks are now flying, almost like bringing together earth and anti-matter. Average working and tax paying people in those countries that had to lend money to support Greece, now have no hope of getting their money back, are furious. New nationalistic political parties are gaining power and support for EU is going down, and the Swiss are laughing.
It is remarkable that Greece, rich in history and advancement in the ancient days, is now on the brink of bankruptcy, older people here remember Onassis and his shipping empire. I am comparing EU to the Roman Empire and Hitler's Third Reich, they did not survive. Similarly the British Commonwealth is slowly separating so what makes EU leaders think that they can develop something others have failed in?
Modern day economy exists on paper and BIT money, there are no gold reserves as there used to be before computers, to back up a countries' printed money. They used to have gold, silver and bronze coinage that were worth the face value. Paper money was simply an IOU issued by banks. Now every dollar that is in bank vaults and peoples' pockets are lent out 20 times, simply by typing numbers on computer screen. One day, the beaver skins and sea shells will come back...
That brings my thoughts to the items that were used for trading before coins. Does anyone have a collection of shells or spear heads?
Is the time right to start buying silver and gold coins only and forget artificially priced ANDA mint sets that only have a sticker to give them value?
In economic terms the EU is actually very much plausible in terms of a common currency and in regular situations it would be effective considering movement of labour and capital however the GFC has exposed the weak fiscal policy of EU economies (Monetary Policy is controlled by the EU Central Bank) but they have rectified their issues and are seeing improvements e.g. Spain etc. However Greece has always been broken and are now going to face the consequences as the only way out even if they adopted the most beneficial economic policies would be bankruptcy as they have let it go on for far to long. However the EU has had issues with polar opposites in economies with Germany powering on while Greece is now such a black hole for stimulatory funds that is dragging down not only the Euro but Germany's growth rate too due to loans which will never be paid back.
Anyway in terms of Economic Unions it appears that one will evolve out of Russia and China or a Eastern Union involving both of them due to aggressive political and economic actions by the United States in a bid to remain a Super Power. This union may either be a currency union including an adoption of a common currency or an economic union.
The Swiss have always had the most resistant economy due to their safe haven status of both funds and precious metals giving them a massive boost in any sort of economic downturn.
In terms of Banking there is no issue in what you are stating however what you have actually described is the process of creating money which leads to real economic growth by transferring Surplus Fund Units to Deficit Fund Users commonly used in Keynsian Economic Policies.
So "oh my florin", is buying Florins at less than bullion price a reasonable security, money in the bank is not growing so why not invest in precious metals? Apparently gold has been a good investment too.
Speculative investments in a bull market such as Previous Metals are always risky as past performance is no indicator of future performance. In terms of gold being a good investment one must remember to buy low and sell high so what is a good investment at one point in a cycle would be terrible at another point e.g. Buying Shares in China prior to their Economic Boom or Buying Shares in US Banks prior to the GFC.
In terms of money in the bank Interest rates on Term Deposits have nearly always been above the Inflation rate leading to a Real growth in funds (excluding the last year or two where interest rates have been dropped to stimulate the economy away from traditional mining and a booming housing market in most of Sydney and Melbourne.) If you are looking at only interest rates then I can point out times in Australia's past where it was more than 20% however inflation was above that.
Generally risk and reward are proportionally related so something that is very risky must have a substantial reward and vice versa.
unless you were living in the 80's in Australia through the recession that we had to have!!!
Quote from: '5 rubles' pid='75439' dateline='1436478194'From the beginning the EU was an ambitious project and in my opinion it was "coined" by socialists and power hungry politicians. It sounds mad trying to bring together countries that are so different in how they are structured and their political and operational principles, like Greece and Germany. It was no surprise that sparks are now flying, almost like bringing together earth and anti-matter.
Quote from: 'oh my florin' pid='75450' dateline='1436493749'In economic terms the EU is actually very much plausible in terms of a common currency and in regular situations it would be effective considering movement of labour and capital ...
The reason we even have a euro today to debate about is because of a miscalculation on the part of the French.
The EU and its precursor organizations has always been dominated by its two largest member-states, France and Germany (Britain might be considered their third power, if it acted more like a player and less like an amused bystander. They're certainly laughing now, with the pound nicely insulated against the euroshock). Pre-war Nazi Germany was easily bigger than France so, post-WWII, France's goal in Europe was to try to create a situation where they'd never be invaded and/or controlled by Germany again. So they trod a fine line between helping free Germany get back up on her feet after occupation, and creating a rival that would later come to dominate France, economically if not militarily. That's why the French would have preferred post-war Germany be divided into four pieces, not just two.
France has always been a strong supporter of the concept of a pan-European currency - they were the centrepiece and instigators of the previous attempt, the Latin Monetary Union prior to WWI. But they preferred a European currency firmly under French leadership.
Suddenly, along comes the end of the cold war and the equally sudden German reunification. The French knew enough about socialism to know that East Germany would be in a mess for a very long time and would both hold Germany back and keep it preoccupied. So that's why they chose that moment to strongly push for the common currency; they figured that by the time Germany got back up and running again, French hegemony over the currency could be locked in. They also knew it would be a once-off opportunity, as once Germany restabilized it would be even stronger.
For a while, the plan seemed to work; it was all the Germans could do to persuade the EEC to change the name of the proposed currency to the more Germanic-sounding "euro" instead of the very French-derived "ecu" - and they needed British help to push that change through. But alas for the French, it hasn't worked for them as well as they'd hoped, long-term. The German economy recovered from reunification much faster than anticipated, such that the German economy today is 30% bigger than the French. And the gap between them is still growing; the German economy is still expanding, while the French have stagnated. That's why, whenever the media wants to know "Europe"'s reaction to Greek schizophrenia, it's Angela Merkel not Francois Hollande they want to ask first.
Quote from: '5 rubles' pid='75439' dateline='1436478194'It is remarkable that Greece, rich in history and advancement in the ancient days, is now on the brink of bankruptcy, older people here remember Onassis and his shipping empire. I am comparing EU to the Roman Empire and Hitler's Third Reich, they did not survive. Similarly the British Commonwealth is slowly separating so what makes EU leaders think that they can develop something others have failed in?
Greece's main problem is geographic. It's too mountainous for large-scale agriculture, and those same mountains were mined out in antiquity so there's nothing left today to mine. For industry, they either needed mines (already ruled out) or a colonial empire of their own (which they never got around to acquiring). For high-tech they need a pool of smart people, and the smart people keep leaving Greece whenever there's a whiff of the all-too-common political instability there. The only "resource" Greece has which it can rely on is tourism, and for that to boom it needs the rest of the developed world to be peaceful and prosperous.
As for comparisons with Rome, remember that the Roman Empire "lasted" for 2000 years, albeit with much reduced territory for most of that time. That's pretty much a record for national longevity. They remain the goal every wannabee superpower in Europe aspires to: "Just like the Romans, only better!". The Romans created their empire by military and technological domination and kept it powered via plunder and slavery. The Germans, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, French, British, Russians and Italians have all tried doing it this way, and they've all failed. So now, they're trying a new way to achieve the same end: diplomacy.
We should be wishing them all the best in this new way. Otherwise, they'll be back to trying it the old way, and I don't think anyone wants that.
That is one way to put the Greek "Situation" Sap, but how is this summary .
The Greek problem is like a little bit of rust on the bonnet of your new car :ok:
Most people simply ignore a tiny flaw in an otherwise amazing automobile, all is good, But at the end of the day that "Tiny" bit of rust WILL eventually destroy the "Integrity" of your car IF you ignore it.
ALL of our currencies/Money are now "Fiat" and based on a Trust/Smoke and mirrors.
I am not saying that our current system of payments is "Flawed" But a debt is a Debt and has to be paid.
The US currently has a debt that they cannot ever repay , Lucky they never joined the EU :angel:
http://money.cnn.com/2015/07/10/news/economy/greece-bailout-europe-deal/index.html?iid=hp-toplead-dom
Angela Merkel visits Greece.
Passport Control at Athens airport.
"Nationality?" asks the immigration officer.
"German," she replies.
"Occupation?"
"Not this time," she says. "Just a visit."
(http://wellthisiswhatithink.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/merkel.jpg?w=614)
"Ve haf vays of rescuing your economy ..."
Greece are actually issuing 2016 euro coins.
You can get a BU set here ... https://www.eurocoinhouse.com/en/country/greece/griekenland-bu-2016
Also the 1 cent, 2 cent, 5 cent and 10 cent have been issued into circulation.
There is no news yet of a 2 euro Commemorative for 2016 which is unusual for Greece because they have issued at least 2 in each of the last 3 years.
Cheers Mike
Gee they seem as dear as us for mint sets and thanks for the link BM but I wish they had better pic's of the coins.
Quote from: 'JeffH' pid='75797' dateline='1437281040'Angela Merkel visits Greece.
Passport Control at Athens airport.
"Nationality?" asks the immigration officer.
"German," she replies.
"Occupation?"
"Not this time," she says. "Just a visit."
(http://wellthisiswhatithink.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/merkel.jpg?w=614)
"Ve haf vays of rescuing your economy ..."
This should have been posted in the Laugh Thread.
Greece did eventually issue two Commemorative €2 coins in 2016. They weren't released until 30th November 2016 though and they issued them both on that day. Mintage of 750,000 each.
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces86464.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces86465.html
I managed to get them after Christmas. There is no news yet on what they are doing in 2017.
Cheers Mike
Quote from: 'brismike' pid='106981' dateline='1490240778'There is no news yet on what they are doing in 2017.
Cheers Mike
But there is ;)
€2 Commemorative circulation coin dedicated to: "ARCHAEOLOGICAL SITE OF PHILIPPI" (maximum issue 744,000 pieces)
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/578/32613925172_ab62487e9b_o.jpg
€2 Commemorative circulation coin dedicated to: "60 YEARS IN MEMORIAM OF NIKOS KAZANTZAKIS" (maximum issue 744,000 pieces)
http://www.emuenzen.de/forum/attachments/kazantzakis-jpg.128394/
Cool, thanks for the info team :good: