A friend allowed me to look at a early QE11 Australian Penny that appears to be a "total brokage".
Total weight of the coin below is 9.1 grams, some 0.35 grams lighter than a normal penny.
The edge of the coin looks like it has been spread somewhat and the "good obv" looks like the start of a broadstrike.
The coin is pictured below and any comments would be appreciated.
Any information as to where this coin could be forwarded for varification would be appreciated.
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10120/Penny_Brokage.jpg)
Walter for verification
I would think not quite real, from the ones ive seen they normally have a stretching effect, this is more like a vice job, hard to say, should be able to see a few strike marks as it stays in for more than one round
Would Walter have a good look and give me an honest opinion please.
I can deliver the coin to you this weekend when we meet at Malvern if you like.
I would like to see better images of the mirror image side but I am not seeing any particular reason why it would be fake. Bruce can you count the rim beads on the obverse please?
Quote from: 'Australian coin' pid='61834' dateline='1415017027'Walter for verification
I would think not quite real, from the ones ive seen they normally have a stretching effect, this is more like a vice job, hard to say, should be able to see a few strike marks as it stays in for more than one round
AC, for Walter's future reference early brockage strikes don't really show the stretching effect.
It's underweight because of the planchet peel on the brockage side below the bust.
Counting the rim beads is important.......
*markn it was MY opinion only*, Walter does not want me saying anything on his behalf, in fact im sure that will result in butt kicking, Walter can look at it for you goldy, but he will not be in the office for a bit, you can bring it along to a event if you want, I can take a lookie but don't loose it, be very careful, I could take some pickie for you with my camera.
Quote from: 'Australian coin' pid='61846' dateline='1415051077'*markn it was MY opinion only*, Walter does not want me saying anything on his behalf, in fact im sure that will result in butt kicking, Walter can look at it for you goldy, but he will not be in the office for a bit, you can bring it along to a event if you want, I can take a lookie but don't loose it, be very careful, I could take some pickie for you with my camera.
If you re-read your post it sounds like you're quoting what Walter said after you showed it to him for verification. And my point stands...AC, for
YOUR reference early brockage strikes don't really show the stretching effect.
We are all aware you work for Walter now, if you don't want to sound like you're acting in some official role for him whenever you post on here I suggest you stop using his name in posts.
Hard to tell from those images Bruce But there is nothing that screams out Fake to me.
Like pp said the weight loss looks like it is caused by the metal peel on the bottom of the coin.
I can't see any reminants of the reverse design elements on the brokerage side so if this is a vice job they used one hell of a powerful vice :ok:
Quote from: 'trout' pid='61849' dateline='1415055263'Hard to tell from those images Bruce But there is nothing that screams out Fake to me.
Like pp said the weight loss looks like it is caused by the metal peel on the bottom of the coin.
I can't see any reminants of the reverse design elements on the brokerage side so if this is a vice job they used one hell of a powerful vice :ok:
I agree with you Trout. If you have any big images of 1964 Melbourne pennies it might be worthwhile seeing if the rim bead alignment on the error matches those images.
QuoteIf you have any big images of 1964 Melbourne pennies it might be worthwhile seeing if the rim bead alignment on the error matches those images.
Here is a half decent image for reference :ok:
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10019/1964_penny~0.jpg)
I count 120 denticals on my coin
Triton.vg also has good images (Jon Saxton's website). It has 120 denticles for Melb as well.
If that is a vice job then it would fool me. No sign of PMD damage to the obverse at all.
Here is another picture of the brokage. Unfortunately, some of the denticles are missing:
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10120/2014-11-04_20-52-49_1739.jpg)
this is my only brockage and compared to that your coin looks good
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/11197/uniface_back.jpg)
I took the original "brockage" coin into three dealers in Melbourne today, they were Nobles Auctions, Universal coins and IS Wright and all decreed that the coin presented was a fake, home made casting job.
So, I shall be informing the owner of the results.
Thanks everyone for all your inputs.
I took pics of that coin for you a while ago, it was put in this thread http://www.australian-coins.net/showthread.php?tid=3158
but ill see if I can add them here too
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10011/back.JPG)
(http://www.australian-coins.net/gallery/albums/userpics/10011/front.JPG)